Adam McGinnis - 2025 ABCA/Soldier Sports NJCAA Div. II Assistant Coach of the Year

[00:00:04] Speaker A: Welcome to the ABCA's podcast. I'm your host Ryan Brownlee. New ABCA Podcast sponsor Driveline are longtime friends and I've used many of their products when I was coaching in the youth camps. Now, if you want to truly optimize your pitcher's workload, Pulse from Driveline Baseball takes simple pitch counts to the next level. Pulse is a wearable sensor that precisely measures every throw your pitchers make on a daily basis. Pulse tracks both throw count and throw intensity. Trusted by MLB organizations like the Cincinnati Reds, elite college programs and individual athletes at all levels, Pulse is changing the way throwing workload is managed. With the Pulse Team Dashboard, you'll be able to make data driven usage decisions to optimize training and injury prevention for your entire team. Visit drivelinebaseball.com Pulse to revolutionize your pitching staff's development and health today. This episode is sponsored by Netting Pros. 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Joining us this week on the ABCA podcast is the 2025 ABCA Soldier Sports NJCA Division 2 Assistant Coach of the Year, Heartland Community College recruiting coordinator Adam McGinnis. Since returning the Heartland coaching staff in 2021, McGinnis has led Heartland to four straight NJCA World Series appearances, including a national championship in 2023. McGinnis on field responsibilities include coaching the hitters and catchers. The 2025 edition of the Hawks hitters had a.347 team batting average, averaged over nine runs per game with 267 extra bases. The Heartland Catching Corps threw out baserunners at a 35% clip. McGinnis runs the student Success program at Heartland and is in charge of operations at the Corn Crib in normal, Illin. McGinnis had a standout playing career at Western Illinois University. Signed professionally with the Chicago White Sox in 2017, spending two years in the organization. Let's welcome Adam McGinnis to the podcast. All right here with Adam McGinnis, ABCA NJCA Division 2 Assistant Coach of the Year now, I think 4 for 4 in World Series appearances at Heartland side. Free agent out of Western Illinois with the White Sox. But Ginny, you and I go way back now. Many, many, many moons. So. [00:03:42] Speaker B: Thanks for having me. Appreciate it. [00:03:45] Speaker A: I feel like you all have a D1 setup at Heartland with the stadium. You have great indoor, you have great weight room. You also have K's academy there for guys if they, they want to work out in the off season too. So I just feel like Heartland has a really good setup for, for every any level of college baseball. [00:04:02] Speaker B: Yeah, I think for us it's. [00:04:06] Speaker A: We. [00:04:06] Speaker B: Don'T love to compare, but there's always the comparison. And especially with other Division 2 junior colleges, I would say we're at a top 1% when it comes to our indoor being fully netted, being able to go live in there, obviously having the corn crib. For everyone familiar with Central Illinois, former Frontier League team, but now they have a prospect league team we share with them, full turf stadium. Especially being in the Midwest, Central Illinois where we're at, that, that's huge for us. And yeah, it definitely helps. And we, we view ourselves in that upper echelon of juco baseball. But like you said, even across the country at other levels, you know, it's. I've seen a lot of places and I would put us in the up there with just a lot of different programs at different levels when it comes to the facility side of things. [00:05:01] Speaker A: What do you feel like ski for you guys, keeping getting back to go to Enid every year, you know, you're having turnover every year, you're gonna lose guys. What do you feel like the key is your guys success to get back to Enid every year? [00:05:12] Speaker B: Yeah, I think one it's knowing what we have to do and changing the expectation of prior to us taking over and all the respect in the world to the guys that were here before us. But there was a lapse in Harlan being in the World Series and they were moving guys on, they were winning games, but it just wasn't getting over that hump. And I feel like now we've set the standard to getting to Enid. Right. And that is the expectation now for us and our guys. And it's the sophomores leading the culture for the new guys coming in and anything less is not good enough. And getting there. And even the year we won it all, it's, you need some things to go your way and winning the national championship's not easy, but the expectation of getting there, and like I said, the culture from the top down, but the, the expectation of the guys that have been here, the guys that have been there coming back, returners, understanding what it takes from all aspects of it. And yes, obviously Enid is baseball centric and you got to be a good baseball team to get there. But we look at the full picture of the teams that we've gotten there and it comes with everything. It comes with the classroom, it comes with the off the field big time weight room. And a lot of times you can tell pretty early on which teams have it and which teams don't. And we've had, fortunately, good kids brought in good kids, yes, talented baseball players, but have the attitude and the mindset of that's our number one goal. Our number one goal is getting there. That's sometimes hard in the junior college world because beyond juco, you're always thinking about your four year. You're thinking about what school am I going to next? Whether guys want to admit it or not, that's on the front of their mind often. But it's getting them to buy into winning a national championship, getting to the World Series, and then the rest of it's going to take care of itself. If you come in, you put in the work, put in the time, the. The school and where you move on to after is that takes care of itself. [00:07:25] Speaker A: Do you guys prep any different going out to Enid? It's a wild bracket. Do you guys even talk about the bracket? I mean, it's a wild, you know, it seems like you guys, the division one juco and then the NAI brackets are the wildest ones we have in college baseball. [00:07:38] Speaker B: Yeah, I think the preparation all year starting in the fall for us has changed a little bit because we know what it takes to win at the World Series. And throughout the year, we play different teams at different levels and all that kind of stuff. And yes, we're going to win baseball games, but it's the understanding of what's truly winning a baseball game when it matters. Right. And we started doing a thing in the fall called the Enid scoreboard, which is we take stats, all that kind of stuff from the game. Yes, runs obviously matter, but we look a lot at free bases, we look a lot at errors, we look a lot at quality of Bats, getting on base, all that kind of stuff, executing jobs, because that's when it becomes most important, right? Yes, you can hit there. You got to score runs to win. Right. But the pitching side of things, when I look back at the years that we've struggled at the World Series, it's all come down to defense and pitching and fielding, your position and that. That's one thing that we highlight throughout the year, so that when we get there, it's not a surprise, it's not a shock. And when the offense is going good while you're there, that just makes it even better, and it makes it a little bit easier. But nothing's ever easy once you get there, man. There's talented teams all across the country that you may not even run into. I think us kind of gearing our schedule a little bit, a little bit more towards what we're going to see at the end of the year has been awesome. You know, we go down to St. John's River State early in the year, play a really good tournament down there, get four or five games, possibly against a bunch of different teams that are in the preseason top 25, and see where we're at and understand where we are at versus where we need to be when it comes time to hopefully go to the World Series again. [00:09:29] Speaker A: I feel like that's a benefit, too, with the schedule, too, because you're going to have to get through your conference tournament. You're going to have to win. Like you can build for that. It's not like you have to stack up wins early. It's not like there's, you know, it's not like you're at large bid portion, basically, you're gonna have to play your way in to get there anyway. [00:09:47] Speaker B: Yeah. Yeah. I think when the at large became a thing, I think it was three years ago now, adding the two new schools to the at large, I think it was good for D2 juco baseball. But we've. We've super focused on not relying on that and taking care of business. Winning our region, winning our district, which has also been realigned a little bit, so we. We're even playing new teams every year that we ran into. I mean, last year we played a team from down in Missouri, and they gave us a really good battle. And it was different because we hadn't played them before. We really didn't know much about them going into it. So there's always things that are changing, but it's focusing on winning the region, winning the district, getting the automatic. If we fall into the at large. Obviously, we'll take it if the year dictates that. But it's not so much about, like you said, just stockpiling wins and trying to get that at large. Man. We need to see where we're at and where we need to get better. Because again, you're going to win baseball games at this level. Like you talked about from the facilities, recruiting stuff, we get good players here, but it's about being able to win and perform when it matters most and putting yourself up against the best competition in our opinion. [00:11:06] Speaker A: You also have an advantage too from a recruiting standpoint because you're in a. Not a huge city, but a big city. But you also have Illinois, Wesley and Illinois State in town with you guys too. That's a very unique setup in Bloomington Normal with what you guys have there. [00:11:18] Speaker B: Yeah, I think for us, us being me, I'm from here originally. I'm from Normal, went to Normal West High School. So it's pretty easy for me to sell the. And I think just the proximity to a lot of really good baseball areas. We're two and a half hours from St. Louis. We're 2:45 from Graham Park. I know it on the dot because we're there so much. Right. We're two hours from the city of Chicago, an hour and a half from some suburbs. We can get to Milwaukee in three hours. Heading towards Iowa. We were just at Iowa City on Friday and that was about 245, I think so. And being right off the interstate off of 74, off of 55. Bloomington Normal is a college town with different businesses as well. State Farm headquarters being here, having around 100 to120,000 people. It's. It's a nice area and it's. Once people get here, a lot of people don't end up leaving here. The amount of ISU and State Farm employees and all that kind of stuff and obviously your family background from the area as well. You know a little bit about it, but it's a great place to be. [00:12:30] Speaker A: If you had to go back and play again now that you've coached for this long, what would you add in as a player? [00:12:42] Speaker B: That's a tough one for me. I think we all. [00:12:44] Speaker A: And that's not taking anything away from you. You had a great playing career too, 100%. You know, I think. I think you're a guy that got the most out of your ability. So I think it would be hard for you to maybe make some tweaks because I think you got the most out of your ability as a player. [00:12:57] Speaker B: Yeah. And I think looking back at my career as a whole, it's the discipline of some things over others. I think obviously nowadays with the era of where baseball's at and the personal development more on the physical side of things and understanding the nutrition, understanding eating habits, understanding obviously the weight room, I never felt like that was an issue for me, but taking care of those things. And to be honest, I thought where I got in my career, yes, was because of my playing ability, but I also thought I took advantage of or what really set me up for success was being a good teammate and being a locker room guy and being that guy, that somewhat of a glue guy and getting opportunities that way as well. [00:13:51] Speaker A: And I would try to tell players that too. Like, I'm not picking the phone up with the scouts if you aren't a great teammate. [00:13:57] Speaker B: Yeah, 100%. And I think for a lot of kids nowadays, it's even from a recruiting aspect for us, it's fun, but it's getting even more difficult. And it's never been easy by any means. But I was talking with a coach about it the other day and you know, you go to Graham park or you go to some of these summer tournaments and being a juco coach, I have the joy of being able to coach a high school travel team as well. So we went to Creekside, we went to grand park, where you go to the Rock, we go to Georgia. All these tournaments. And the amount of 88 to 90 arms in the summer now, and with average off speed, there's a million of them out there. And it's about finding the separators for kids, which is the homework like you talked about. It's behind the scenes. It's having the conversation with the, the high school coach, the summer ball coach and them relationships that you trust where they're not going to BS you. I think that's a big part of it is getting guys within the game. You trust that if they tell you, hey, this is a kid you're going to want to look at, it's like, okay, yeah, I'm going to take that a little bit more seriously. And it's still for us, like I talked about earlier with the culture, it's all encompassing. It's the classroom, it's the grades. You know, I, I know junior colleges had a stigma in the past of education, and back in the day it was sort of a factor. And for us, it's our goal every year is a 3.5 team GPA. We've been around that mark, we actually broke it last spring from the academic side of things. So it's one of those things that everything is evolving and getting the right guys in is just as important as the baseball side of it for us. [00:15:44] Speaker A: Seems like you and Coach Razzo worked well together. It seems like he gives you quite a bit of autonomy with the position players. [00:15:51] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, we have a great relationship. He's been awesome for me, and I've known him since his days when he was still playing a little bit, being through. You had mentioned K's Academy earlier, being a facility here in town with Josh Cowton. Met them when I was still playing, was working out there, training, doing lessons. Actually, when I ended up getting released that year, got me to come be a Heartland for the semester. Got my first taste of college coaching, then went back to Western for two years to get my masters and be GA there. Sorry, I got sensor. I got sensor lights behind my filing cabinet. But we work very well from the pitching side of things. He takes care of that. And for me, it's hitters, it's catchers, it's outfielders more so. We also have another assistant who's been awesome adding to the staff. Baylor Fish, his name, Iowa boy from Marion. He's been great. He works a lot with our hitters as well. It's been a fun breed of new school and old school. He brings a little bit of that new flavor to what we do here. From more of a data side of things. But just a thought, and you know me, I'm from the Brownlee tree of baseball, right? I'm a little bit more old school, man. I'm about executing. I'm about offensive game plan. I'm about what we're thinking approach, all that kind of stuff and obviously the mechanics and a lot of that, too. But it's been a good mix because we got three coaches here. It's three of us trying to figure it all out on a yearly basis. And with me being a catching guy as well, I work with the pitchers, too, talking with the pitchers, catchers, communicating how to call a game, how to read a swing, how to dictate what we're trying to do to certain guys. It's been awesome having the freedom and the flexibility that he's given me, which has been earned through trust and being around each other for a while and knowing what each other are thinking and being on the same page. He always. When we have recruiting visits, it's funny. He likes. He's a little bit more new school. He's a Little bit more old school, and I don't give a crap unless as long as we win. And that's all that matters to me. So. [00:18:10] Speaker A: Yeah, and I was going to ask you if you let them, your catchers call the game, because you had really good feel for that. You know, you. You were a good. And I think that's maybe a difficult thing as a coach. You were such a good game caller in college and I'm sure in pro ball as a player. And I was intrigued to see if. If you're calling pitches or you're letting them run a majority of it. [00:18:32] Speaker B: Yeah, I. I think the biggest. So our. Our catchers run the game and our pitchers run the game. And that's kind of an anomaly in the game of baseball these days. But I'm a true believer in them dictating the outcome of what they're going to do. And it's a not. It's not a. Here's the keys. Good luck. Right. It's having a conversation. And we tell guys all the time you're gonna fail, and we want you to fail while you're here, because I want to have a conversation with the catcher on. Trust me, there's been times this fall where I'm like, we're getting. We're getting an earpiece, man. I need to take a little bit more control here. But then I remind myself that I want it to be a learning moment. I want to ask, hey, what were you thinking in this situation? Well, I was trying to go fastball up and in. He didn't execute it. All right, great. And that's, for me, what I've always felt with calling a game. And yes, we have numbers and you can see statistics and the synergy and all these scouting reports, and all of it's great, but at our level, it's still not rock solid ever. Right. Personally, that's my personal opinion. And it's having the pitcher to be able to have conviction in his pitches because that's what he wants to throw. We have some guys that are like, I just throw whatever he calls 24 7. I don't care. I don't want to waste time. I want to get the ball back to the catcher, and here we go. Let's get this thing going. But it's the learning side of it, because I remember through college and even getting to professional baseball, it was, if you don't know, you don't know. And you're kind of on your own, right. And you're not going to learn unless you know how it's done. I think that's a hard part about baseball nowadays. I'm at the facility doing lessons and I talk to catchers at the 10U level and it's like yeah, we got the wristband and coaches calling the pitches and I'm like, okay. I guess like maybe it's that important because again, it takes execution, it takes, you can call the right pitch, you can hit your spot and it can still get hit out of the ballpark. And I think putting ownership in their hands gives them a responsibility and a confidence in what they're doing on the baseball field. Even though they are just kids. We got 18 to 20 year old guys and some of them get here and most of them have at some point called their own game, but others are like, hey, I'm, I'm going to need some help with this. And we talk sequencing, we talk about video breakdown, what to look for in hitters, different parts of the lineup, runners in scoring position, every. Everything that coaches are thinking in the dugout. But now these guys are doing it on their own. [00:21:15] Speaker A: So hey, will we ever get. You have a bunch of multi sport guys on your roster or not? I mean I bring it up because you're a hockey and basketball player and baseball player in high school. Like I, you just don't see as much of it anymore. So I was, I was wondering how many multi sport guys you have because the Midwest I think you still see it a little bit. [00:21:34] Speaker B: 100. Yeah. I would say our biggest crossover is we got some. And right now I'm just thinking about some incoming guys. I, I got some golfers, I got some basket. Some basketball players, they're listening smart. [00:21:49] Speaker A: I wish I would have played golf in high school. [00:21:52] Speaker B: You might as well get the swing tuned up while you're young because it doesn't get any better the older you get. Right. But no basketball we get. I see a lot of football still and I think for me it's. I like those kind of guys, man. I like the mentality of those guys and know that weight room aspect of it and the physicality and the toughness and the mental toughness that other sports provide. That yes baseball does, but on a different wavelength. It's not all the same. And I love multi sport athletes for those reasons. I think every sport gives you a different opportunity. I also understand why there is more specification early in having more baseball guys because just baseball guys have had success too. And so I would say it's probably 60 play multiple sports in high school or at least did up until like sophomore year 40 are mostly just baseball guys would be my guess. [00:22:57] Speaker A: Where'd your leadership come from? I mean my brother called me as soon as we got you committed because he was a basketball official and he paid attention a lot of that stuff and just talked about your leadership. I go round and round with that. I think some of it's innate, you're born with it, but I do think you can develop some of it. But where did your leadership come from? Because I think I felt like you always had it. [00:23:17] Speaker B: Yeah, I think for me it was a lot of parenting and it was a lot of coaching that I had had. I think it was truly. Yes, I think some came very natural to me. I have an older sister who was a three sport athlete in high school, played college basketball, also a national champion. We she would get called mom on all her teams, I would get called mom on my teams from some teammates and I think it was one from my parents setting the tone of what's right versus wrong and also just through experiences, through failures, through being around people that weren't great leaders and seeing why and leading in a different route. And I think back to even Coach Hawkins, Normal West High School played for him for three years and just the, the standards that were set and they weren't unwavered from. I know all the time I see him on a regular basis just being close to home still. And it's even funny to this day that used to it was, hey, everyone's going to look the exact same way, you're going to wear the same thing. If we're going stirrups, we're all going stirrups. There's no wrist tape. And I give him crap because he's gotten a little lenient over the years, which you have to at the times. But I would say it was the mentors and coaches and parents that I had. But I do think there is a natural aspect to it and I will say that's one thing. Being at the junior college level is always interesting, right? Four years you have pretty established leaders by the time guys are there for three to four years and they know how things are done. And at the junior college level you got two years with the guys. So it's sophomores leading freshmen usually through about the fall. But at that point it also doesn't really matter because it's not a, I'm three years older than you, I'm more experienced, I know how this should be. It was always, it's always interesting to see the dynamic of that for us as well. [00:25:27] Speaker A: So you Talked about watching other people from a leadership standpoint. With that inexpensive experience, do you feel like you learn more from what not to do than what to do when you're watching other people? Maybe, yeah. [00:25:39] Speaker B: I think a lot of times, yeah. It's always funny because even from just not a leadership standpoint, but from a playing standpoint, I was always just a student of every game that I watched. It's. I would be watching a basketball game or I would be watching a baseball game with a different level of focus for my position. Right. I tell people the story all the time. My true first catching coach was Dusty Napoleon, freshman year at Western Illinois University. Right. I never. We didn't do the lessons. Yes. I had coaches. I played youth baseball. I wasn't a place like K's training academy two, three nights a week lifting and hitting and getting my catching lessons in which I think there's a great benefit for it now. And I work doing all that kind of stuff. But I learned from watching. I watched Yadier Molina catch and took things, tried. It was like, that didn't work. I'm not good enough to do that yet. So let's try something else. Let's simplify it a little bit. So I would say it goes both ways. I would say you see things you like, you try things, see how it works for you. If it doesn't work great, you try something else. And you see different things from the intangible side of sport. It's, wow, that looked like really bad body language there. And that was not professional. Or he showed up as catcher right there. It's like, that was gross. Don't do that. Right. So I would say it definitely goes both ways. [00:27:15] Speaker A: And you're really close to your family. I mean, that's part of the reason we got you to come to Western because your grandparents. So, I mean, that's a big part for you is staying in that region. [00:27:23] Speaker B: Yes. [00:27:24] Speaker A: With your family. [00:27:25] Speaker B: Yeah, Yeah. I would say it's important to me. My sister's out in California now, so she's a little bit further away. But, yeah, family's always been very important to me. My younger brother's back here working in Bloomington Normal. Just graduated, finished his career at Augustana up in the Quad Cities. Parents, grandparents, all within about two and a half, three hours of me. And I've always just felt like that was something that was important, allowing them to come see games. Yeah. It's one of those things that, again, you learn a lot. And I'll still. On a Sunday afternoon, I'll go over and watch football with my dad and hang out over there and take the dog. Give him some me time. Rich is coming off a knee surgery, so he's getting healthy now. But yeah, man, family's always been very important to me. [00:28:18] Speaker A: I knew you're going to be okay. Freshman year when we were at Middle Tennessee and we played in 18 degree weather and you're late, you're laying in your gear in the bathroom. That's a good story. We didn't play the first weekend. It was bad scheduling on my part. So we're going to middle to play in that music city tournament. But it was still cold and we hadn't played the first weekend. So we played double header and it was 18 degrees and I go to check on you. Trainer goes, guinea's in the bathroom and I go. And you're just laying down. I'm like, are you all right? You're like, I don't know if I need to poop or puke, coach, but I'll be okay. [00:28:54] Speaker B: I was just glad shout out to Middle Tennessee State to this day for having a heated bathroom. I was just glad I found the only heat that was in the stadium that I could get out of there. [00:29:08] Speaker A: Help. Yeah. [00:29:10] Speaker B: And I think even it's funny just bringing up memories, man. The. I remember even that game, I talk about the bad body language stuff and I remember getting hit twice. I think it was the first game I got hit twice in the same spot and you know, it was literally 18 degrees and second time I tossed my bat and I'm like how that probably wasn't a good look but man, did that hurt. It's colder and out here right now. [00:29:33] Speaker A: So you are probably the only reason. If I didn't take this job, if I would have stayed at Western because you were coming to coach with us, you would have been probably the only reason that I would have stayed in coaching because I want was good wanted to get an opportunity to coach with you. But I made the right choice. But literally that probably would have been the only reason I would have stayed was because no. [00:29:52] Speaker B: And that means a lot. And obviously that Western Illinois is very special for both of us through the opportunities that it gave me. Gave you all that kind of stuff and it was all meant to be. I had a great experience coaching there. [00:30:07] Speaker A: I always tell it's hands on training. I tell people that all the time. It's the best place. It's challenging, but it's hands on. You get to do everything there. It's tremendous. [00:30:17] Speaker B: 100 well, even the, the gas That I ended up working with. It's. They go on to other schools and get their other jobs post graduation, and they're like, what do you mean? I'm only working with the soccer team here, and I'm gonna get paid a little nicer, too. And it's more specified. And it's like, yeah, man. At a place like Western and love that place and always will. It was. You're doing everything. You're helping out, even with other teams and even coaching under coach Pasco. It was a good experience for me and building a different relationship. And I tell people, too, the experience I had after you left, that kind of set the tone for what my coaching career was going to be. And I was very glad I was there, because I don't know how it would have gone if someone who didn't know what that place was about was the graduate assistant. 22, had never coached before, trying to keep kids there and trying to keep people around that while they were going through the hiring process and all of that. So it was a little bit of a sink or swim, but it was also. You learn that way. And we. I learned a lot in that short window between Pasco or you leaving and Pasco getting hired. But it set the tone for what it is to be a coach, and you got to deal with things that come up. And obviously for you, there's never been hard feelings because you took a great opportunity and obviously you're doing all right for yourself. So. Oh, man. All good. And I'm thankful. Grateful for our relationship that we've had for. It's funny, I hate saying it, but shit, man, it's been. [00:31:48] Speaker A: It doesn't seem like. It does not seem like it because you're our first recruiting class at wiu. I mean, you really were one of the people that I penciled when I came over from Iowa. I'm like, we have to. We have to get him, like, if. If we want to start getting this thing turned around. He's a person that we have to have here in the program and that all played out. What were your biggest differences between college and pro ball. [00:32:16] Speaker B: From a personal standpoint? [00:32:17] Speaker A: Like, could be on field, could be off field. What do you feel like the biggest difference is? Like, say somebody's listening in right now that he doesn't know about, you know, college or pro. What do you feel like the biggest differences between professional baseball and college baseball were? [00:32:31] Speaker B: Yeah, I think a little bit about what I talked about earlier. It's the discipline and a lot of time management. Because as much as you're on the road and you're doing things and you're playing baseball and all this kind of stuff, it's finding a way to get better in a lot of different aspects of life. You do are on the road, all that kind of stuff. But you do have downtime as well and how you're controlling that. And I would say with college baseball and playing for you and every coach is different, but somewhat the structure of everything. My first realization of, oh, this isn't college anymore. It's just like simple things of communication, but also. And it's all organization based, but the weight room training a little bit different. Right. And the speed and agility is a little bit different and just all encompassing. Well, obviously not having class was a big bonus to professional baseball because. But then again, like I said, you do have this time to figure out other things and try other things and go on hikes. And honestly, some guys were starting jobs and doing things outside of baseball, preparing for life after baseball. I wasn't one of those because I always knew I wanted to coach. But I would say the biggest difference was kind of. And new experiences as well. I never thought in my life that I would live in Great Falls, Montana, not just Great Falls. I didn't think I'd ever step foot in the state of Montana. I'm not a big traveler personally. [00:34:19] Speaker A: It's beautiful up there though. [00:34:20] Speaker B: Oh, it was absolutely one of the best experiences I've ever had. [00:34:25] Speaker A: That's only vast is what I can. [00:34:27] Speaker B: Use to describe in our trip from Great Falls to Helena. It's. You're driving through mountains and streams and you have no cell service. And obviously all the kids like us at that time are like, why don't I have cell service versus just looking out the window and actually enjoying where you are. Right. But I think the business side of it too goes without being said as well. The being a free agent. And I signed for $1,000 in a plane ticket and it was the best experience of my life. And I would have done it for free. Right. But it's. You see the business side of it with numbers, opportunities, guys that are playing. You're also low culture shock. You playing with guys from different parts of the world. And that was probably the biggest. Going from Macomb, Illinois to out to Arizona for that first camp and extended spring training. It was a lot, a lot of just that, a lot of culture shock. [00:35:30] Speaker A: Are you still giving a lot of lessons? [00:35:32] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:35:36] Speaker A: How's that evolved for you over the years? Yeah. You're doing different now in your lesson setting than when you first started. [00:35:44] Speaker B: It all depends. Being a catching guy, it's every kid that I work with and I'll work. I work with softball players, I've worked with baseball players, all that kind of stuff. I would say the biggest thing it has evolved to is just understanding what each kid needs. I joke about it sometimes with people, but I work with kids that don't know which leg, which impact goes on which leg. And then I work with very talented high school guys, are committed to going to division ones and even a little bit of college guys here and there when they're back for winter break and stuff like that. But it's always, I would say that's the biggest evolution is just understanding what each kid needs and understanding where the game of baseball has gone. It's. I talked about it earlier. I'm very old school. I wasn't catching on a knee. Having guys that have played for me here. And I've evolved as a coach in a lot of ways. And the catching position is a big one of them. And adapting to knee down versus being on two feet at all times, but still understanding again, what's right for each kid. I'm still a true believer in, before you get to high school baseball, I don't want my guys on a knee. I think it breeds laziness. I think it breeds trying to pick everything and not block the baseball. Other guys have different opinions for sure, and I don't disagree with their opinions because they're their opinions. But it's the game or the position of catching is so much more than physical for me. It's getting guys to understand how important the relationship with the pitching staff is. That's hard in a lesson setting, Right. But through talking with guys and yes, we receive, yes, we block, yes, we do footwork stuff, yes, we talk about tags at the plate. Yes, we talk about all these different things that go into being a good catcher. But it's having conversations with them about calling a game. It's having conversations about being a leader on the field. I would say the number one thing for me, and if catchers are out there listening, it's take control of the game, be a communicator behind the. Behind the plate. Even when I get guys in here, my biggest learning curve with them is them being afraid to be loud and be wrong. I'm fine with you being loud and being wrong. I'd rather you do that than be quiet and be right. It's being commanding back there. And then the pitching staff, all that Kind of stuff. Just understanding the importance of knowing your guys, knowing what they can go to in a 31 count. Is he able to spin it? Is he not execution? But back to like you said, the lesson side of things, I would say honestly the biggest thing for me has been the one knee down and just understanding what. What each kid needs. And it's always funny because everyone wants the better pop time and is that. [00:38:53] Speaker A: Usually what they're coming in for is there's a lot of showcase stuff. [00:38:57] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, there's a lot of them and I have a good conversation with them. I actually had a conversation with a couple of my catchers today while they were just doing their daily receiving stuff that talking about big league averages of stuff and understanding what the big league average pop time was. And I think on the stat website I was looking at. Sorry, I don't know the names of it. To all you out there that are upset by that. Like I said, I'm old school, man. I just use Google still. But it's this year it's been a 1.98, right. And it's. You see the showcase events and yeah, there's sophomores in high school right now that are at an event and they're popping a 175. Okay, good. Right. But is it on the bag? Is it in the spot? It's not in game, all that kind of stuff. And it's bringing a. Realize a realistic expectation to what you are. And then now obviously all of a sudden when I tell my catcher that he's like, oh, well, I'm about a 185 right now, so like I should be in the league. Like we got a long way to go. [00:40:02] Speaker A: Factor in, is the runner going or not? Is there a batter in there? [00:40:06] Speaker B: Did you get a clean transfer? 5050 on that one? [00:40:13] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:40:13] Speaker B: And it's. It's always funny when. Because again, like I said, the catching position has evolved, but not that much when it comes to the true bones of what the position is. It's. You look at guys nowadays and I've watched a lot of the playoff games and it's the same thing it always has been. You know, my biggest fear is getting those robot umpires in there and devalue the art of receiving and all kind of stuff. But we'll save that for a different time. [00:40:44] Speaker A: Where are you starting with the hitters? Your hitters at Heartland, as in anything when you get them, where you starting with? [00:40:50] Speaker B: Yeah, the hard part about again for. [00:40:53] Speaker A: Us because you guys start playing fairly early, right? Just with the Weather, you guys start playing a little bit earlier than some. [00:41:01] Speaker B: Of the other 100%. So we'll, we'll start as soon as they get on campus. So the first day of class we're going to, and usually it's about two and a half weeks. Three weeks from then is the Puma showcase. I always have a hard time with it because I always felt like when I was changing things or when I was being coached, it's like, hey, try this, try this, do this, change this. And then you go, you got a game in a week or two weeks. And it's like, now I'm thinking about it in the batter's box versus taking the hitter. You become a robot in there. You, you're thinking about mechanics and am I doing this? And it's like, well, we're here to compete. So really early on, it's just super minor things. We talk a ton about approach, we talk a ton about what we're trying to execute, thought process, what the pitcher is trying to do to us. [00:41:55] Speaker A: How much of that is the first time your hitters have heard some of that stuff? When you're talking about approach, I think a lot. And when you say approach, what do you mean for somebody who's listening? Because I think that word gets thrown around a lot. What does the word approach mean to you? [00:42:10] Speaker B: Yeah, for me it is having a plan of what you're looking for. And it can be different for guys. There's been times that a guy's approach is he needs to think middle, backside. You have to think about hitting this ball off the right field wall. There's other guys that when they do that, they're super late. So it's changing their mindset, their attitude to, okay, it's not poll. But I need to think about my timing being I'm going to hit this off the right field scoreboard as a lefty because I'm late on everything else. It's. Some guys want to look pitch right. I'm still a big believer. And we look fastball away, we adjust to everything else, which is a very obviously common approach. But that worked for me and I know that worked for me. But it's adapting to kids that are like, well, if I do that, even I'm thinking, I'm like, so what are you thinking in the batter's box? You're like, I'm not. And they're hitting really well. And I'm like, well, then keep doing that. And it's hard. It's hard for some people because unless you have a really good relationship with your guys. You don't know what they're actually thinking. Right. It's. I remember. And hopefully you don't take offense to this, but if a coach tells you something and you hit a ball right back up the middle on a line right after that, off the machine, and the coach is like, see, I told you. And you're like, I didn't change anything. Gotcha. Right? But it's. [00:43:39] Speaker A: I mean, that's what I tell guys in pro ball, that we're going to pick all the time. Like, you're going to get told a lot of stuff. It's okay to nod your head and just keep doing what you're doing. [00:43:47] Speaker B: Yeah. For me as a coach, and I actually heard this from Erich, my coach in Great Falls, my last year of playing was if you can learn. And that was extended spring training. And then we went into short season out in Great Falls. So I was with him for maybe three, four months. And I'll never forget it. He said, if you can take two or three things from me in this time frame, I did my job. And I think you get to a point in your career and I ask recruits this all the time. It's how many hitting coaches or coaches have you had up until this point? And they're like, oh, not that many. And I'm like, okay, well, have you ever seen a guy talk on Twitter? Have you ever had a hitting lesson? Have you ever had a summer ball coach? Have you had a high, high school coach, junior high coaches, dad giving you hitting advice? You take all of this information, and the whole goal for each individual player is to. They have to become their best hitting coach because I have my hands on these guys for two years, and then they go off to their four year. So then they get there and they may be told something that they're like, oh, that doesn't work for me. But they're going to try to do it because coach told them to do it, or you're not going to play. And then you just start thinking what you have to do to actually produce on the field. And that's my biggest goal. With every single one of our guys. I want each guy to become their best individual hitting coach. Because I'm not in their brain. I felt like I was a good hitter. I knew what made me a good hitter. It's my job to learn what each of these guys individually have to be thinking, have to look for, have to swing, like to put them in the best position to have success and be their best hitting coach. We talked about the lessons a little bit. I always think it's funny because I do like I said, I work with really eight to high school seniors and some of these kids it's. They come in and hey what do we talk about last week? I forget. [00:45:58] Speaker A: Write it down. [00:45:59] Speaker B: So. So we're doing. We're doing a hitting lesson for six weeks. But you forget what we talked about each week every time. So I know you haven't gone home and hit extra to work on what we talked about and you're just expecting it to take care of itself. And we're going to relearn it every week for six weeks so we can get really good at remembering that one thing hopefully. Right. But I think it's the same way with college kids. You tell them things sometimes and until they buy into it, until they feel it, until they trust may never change. Right. And they have to be willing to make those adjustments as well. [00:46:34] Speaker A: So your pregame dailies for catchers the same for all your guys? [00:46:38] Speaker B: Yeah. Yeah. We. We've added a couple of things here and there. [00:46:41] Speaker A: Would you add. [00:46:42] Speaker B: I started using some of the weighted ball. [00:46:44] Speaker A: Yep. [00:46:45] Speaker B: Stuff I see a lot and there's a couple really good. [00:46:50] Speaker A: What do you have in them? Focus with the weighted balls on receipts. [00:46:53] Speaker B: More so movement up through. [00:46:55] Speaker A: Yeah. Trying to work it back into this. [00:46:57] Speaker B: Yeah. Just the feel of it. I, I follow a lot of X accounts, Twitter accounts that catching guys out. [00:47:08] Speaker A: There shout out to the catching community. I think it's 100%. I think it's the. The most forward thinking group we got. [00:47:15] Speaker B: Yeah. And it's seeing the guys that post the big leaguers pre games and how diligent they are with their pregame preparation and honestly going back to a previous question you had about something you might change. It's probably stuff like that where it's not. I'm just rolling out of bed going to catch the bullpen, stretch a little bit, hit BP and here we go. It's seeing them in game 160. They're in the bullpen still doing their pre game prep work. Obviously they have the ability to take many hacks on the road and all that kind of stuff or have them supplied for them. [00:47:49] Speaker A: But it's all routines and habits to build up to the game. I think all peak performers have that some routines that we're going to build up to now get ready to go. [00:48:02] Speaker B: Compete 100 and that's what with our infielders, outfielders, catchers, we, we have them. Do we call them dailies where it's after throwing, go into your dailies, take about 10 minutes of whether it's short hop stuff, whether we're doing blocking dailies for catchers, switch it up day to day, different drill sets, all that kind of stuff. And the. The hard part. And again, baseball to get very good at it. I think about the. I can't even remember what company it was for, but Adley Rushman did the commercial of catching baseballs, and it was like they were counting and it was like 999, 1000. Just receiving the ball over and over and over again. And you can tell he's bored. He didn't actually catch that much, obviously, but just the tediousness of what you have to do to become great and. [00:48:58] Speaker A: Be able to maintain your concentration and focus in that moment. [00:49:02] Speaker B: 100%. 100%. And I think a lot of times the kids want the new fix. They want the big change. They want to. Oh, I'm not hitting for power. So I want this coach to tell me I should add a leg kick when that's not. That's not what we're doing, man. Like, you don't need that if you need it for timing. And you're out front of everything and we got to get in your back hip a little more. Great. But it's the kids want because that's fun, right? Changing your swings. Fun to train. What's not fun to train is getting really good and then just doing the same thing over and over and over again. And those are the guys that make it. I think of guys that we've had that are in professional baseball now. It's. They'll have conversation with our guys that are here. And even going from the college to the professional level, these kids think that these professional baseball players are thinking such a different thing than they are because they're at a higher level. And usually their advice is don't overthink. Don't change your approach from what's always made you good. It's the same thing from the mechanic side of things. You don't have to change everything all the time because then we're always chasing a feeling that we may never get right. [00:50:19] Speaker A: You remember when Sal Fasano came and spoke at the leadoff dinner? That was one of the other things. I. Yeah. Because I want to get your take. I had my take, but I wasn't out in the hallway with you guys. [00:50:29] Speaker B: Yeah. I'll never forget it, honestly. And cm, I. What teams you with? [00:50:33] Speaker A: These are the Angels now the Angels. [00:50:35] Speaker B: Okay. And sometimes when you see him in the dugout shots. And I'm like, oh, I remember that guy. Yeah. So Sal came and his teammate of yours at Evansville. [00:50:45] Speaker A: My brother. [00:50:46] Speaker B: Brother. Okay. [00:50:47] Speaker A: But he used to come work out with us. [00:50:49] Speaker B: Oh yeah, Sal came and I think it was, I think it was A Brophy Hall, 6am Brophy Hall, 6aM 6am Practice on a Friday. [00:50:59] Speaker A: And that was Sunday because. [00:51:01] Speaker B: Sunday. [00:51:01] Speaker A: Sunday. Yep, Sunday. [00:51:02] Speaker B: Okay. So he came in and, you know, some of us are getting the sleep out of our eyes. And he has a talk with the catchers about toughness and showing no pain. And all of a sudden he turns around and punches a brick wall. And Brophy hall is not new by any means. I think at that time it was over a hundred years old. And you see the wall shake and this guy just punches it as hard as he can. And we're. There's, I think there was four of us at the time looking at each other and we're like, man, this guy's got a screw or two loose. But I got a bill, by the. [00:51:43] Speaker A: Way, from physical Plant because you guys were blocking on the. In your shin guards in the cloud in the hallway. So you guys cutting it up. You skid up the hallway. So I gotta build from the shout out. [00:51:55] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:51:56] Speaker A: Facilities people at Western because I got a bill for $500 to clean the skid marks off the, the floor. [00:52:03] Speaker B: I love it, man. But honestly, from that talking that day of working with him again, you, you learn things throughout your career. And something I even have brought into coaching is showing catchers, hey, man, if you're hurt, you're hurt and we'll get you out of the game. Besides that, you're going to take balls off the forearm, you're going to get a foul ball off the thigh, like not the end of the world. I want to see that toughness because I think that shows a lot about who a kid is. And yes, it is. It doesn't feel good. Everybody knows getting hit by it, but I think even when it comes to hit by pitches, even nowadays, it's like we talk about not getting out of the way of pitches and we do a couple things to train it here and there. And honestly, we're still not great at it because I think it's a mentality of I'm going to do anything I can to get on base. And some kids have it, some don't, and some need to be trained how to get hit by a pitch. You're not just going to set up the machine and shoot baseball. Said a kid. Nowadays but it is actually a skill to stand there and understand that, hey, I'm doing this for the team. I'm getting myself on base. The best players I've ever had weren't afraid to get hit by pitches. It's you see the guys that make it again. [00:53:15] Speaker A: That's an approach thing too though, because you're staying in there. You have to be able to stay in there, especially when you start to see really good off speed pitches and, and good breaking balls that are going to start at you and work away like that. That's part of an offensive approach too, is staying in there. [00:53:30] Speaker B: 100%. 100%. And again, the. If anybody out there has got a great training method for that, I would very be interested in hearing and I think other coaches would as well because the more you talk to coaches, even at the higher level. And one of our guys was on a visit to a very good Division 1 program and he texted me as soon as he left and he said, hey man, I got this new drill. I saw that they were teaching the kids not to get out of the way of pitches and because he knows that's something that we super value and have never really had a great way of training it and definitely more than willing to hear anything that's out there. But the cool thing with you guys. [00:54:15] Speaker A: That'S probably the cool thing with your guys going out on visits too, is they're going to bring some stuff back to you guys that they're seeing. [00:54:20] Speaker B: Yeah. When they're going, yeah, 100, 100. And it's like we talk about with our players and everything and me as a coach, it's like we're always, we always need to evolve. We always need to learn new things. And I'm learning new things through stuff I see online and again, I'm not a huge Twitter guy, but I'll be on it and I'll see something and I'll be like, oh, I kind of like that. Or it's like, that's kind of eyewash. I would never do that. But yeah, our guys go out and they'll watch practices and see practices and communicate with coaches and come back, hey, they said this, they said this. And some of it I agree with some of it I'm like, well, I don't really know how we'd implement that here, but just so open your eyes and your mind to learning and growing and trying different things. [00:55:10] Speaker A: You know, I knew you kind of had some of the stuff that we worked on. I knew set in because one of the first calls I got from you was getting pee performance stuff to give to the guys. [00:55:19] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:55:19] Speaker A: Are you still implementing a lot of the stuff? [00:55:22] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, we. That, that's something that I'm very passionate about and that's all because of you, to be honest. And I think the. And it doesn't have to be just a certain person or a certain guy or gal that does mental training, all that kind of stuff. But I think that's the biggest disconnect that high school kids have to the college level because they're not getting that. And I completely understand it as well. At the high school level you have coaches that are also teachers and they can't, they don't have enough one on one time with you to take away from practice time to do some of the mental training stuff. But even with my high school team, I try to implement some things. We're not doing all the classroom sessions, but it's implementing little things here and there. And it's always funny when you think about again, the guys that have been most successful. It's more times than not the guys that have the mental side of baseball figured out. That's why I got as far as I did. I wasn't the toolsiest player in the world, but I knew the game, I knew how to deal with the failure. And I think for our guys, a lot of that is a struggle because when we're recruiting for you to come here, a lot of guys that we bring in are the 3, 4 leadoff hitter on their high school team and they've never not played on their summer teams. And it's, how do we get through dealing with failure? I'm facing better arms than I've ever faced in my life. It's not all going to be perfect, right? But all these kids, they have an expectation that I have to be perfect every single day of practice. It's like, no, you don't. You just got to get better every day. You're going to have bad days. And something we implement from those is leaving it all at the field. It's having an escape. It's being able to step away from the game of baseball. And again, culture wise, our guys are in here hitting 24 7. I can hear them down there hitting in the gym right now. Now sometimes you need to step away when it's getting too much and having that way to disconnect. And again, even the kids that think it's dumb, you still ask them after the fact, it's like, why did you think it was dumb? And they're like, Well, I just didn't get a lot out of it. This. That I'm like, okay, well, on the mound, you changed your breathing routine and you have a better breath in between pitches, and you have a reset. Oh, I guess I did get something out of it. And it's the subconscious of whether they know it or not and whether they want to sit in the classroom with me for 45 minutes to an hour talking about failures and controlling what you can control and all that side of stuff. They're still getting stuff out of it. Right. And you even saw that at Western. I'm sure there were some guys that were bought into it, and there were other guys that would be rather doing anything else than that. [00:58:15] Speaker A: And I think part of it is if you've never really struggled before, if you've never struggled on the baseball field or been punched in the mouth by baseball, you don't really see a value in it until that stuff starts happening. But you have to introduce it. For a guy that's never had failure before, had to learn. You have to introduce it because they're going to face it at some point. So hopefully some of it gets in there a little bit because, hey, this is coming for you. And we do talk about this a lot. I think the reframe is. If you are a college baseball player, if you're a pro baseball player, that comes with playing the game at that level. Is the struggle part of it. Like that you should fully embrace that there's going to be some rough times at the college and professional baseball level. Just embrace that part of it and embrace the challenge of getting punched in the mouth, adjusting to it, learning from it, and then moving on like. Like that. That you should embrace that part if you're gonna play. Yeah. Levels. [00:59:11] Speaker B: I. I tell guys all the time, when you can. When you can strike out and smile, that's when I know you're in a pretty good place. Because guess what? Sometimes you're just going to get beat. Sometimes you executed two pitches and you chase the slider in the dirt because you hadn't seen the slider yet. [00:59:30] Speaker A: And you're not trying to strike out. By the way, talked about that. He's like, players aren't trying to do bad. Like, that's just not how they're built. They're not trying to. [00:59:39] Speaker B: To. [00:59:39] Speaker A: To fail. They're not trying. They're just. That's part of the game. [00:59:43] Speaker B: And if that guy's smiling after striking out, yeah, he's not happy about it, but he knows he got beat and he Knows how talented he is and he's confident in his ability. That. All right, you got me there. I'll see you two more times. And I think with the mental side of it, too, and the trainings that you had sent over to me and that I've done a lot with the guys is the. Just. Even the routine development like you talked about going through in a bat routine, what do you do every time you step in a batter's box? To this day, I talk about that every winter with guys. And I do my routine that I did from freshman year of college until I was told I wasn't good enough to play baseball anymore. Because that was something that. It just put you in the comfort zone. And there's a lot of different aspects to what mental training actually is, and it's all about putting you in the best position. [01:00:30] Speaker A: I just call peak performance. Now, you guys, you introduce yoga to him at all? [01:00:35] Speaker B: No, that means I would have to do it, man. I need to get back into. You were the one. [01:00:38] Speaker A: And another compliment to you. You really were the one reason we were able to keep doing it, because if you would have been like, ah, this. This stinks, or whatever. Well, you were the reason we kept doing it, because I want to try to keep you on the field as long as possible. And I knew it was going to help your hamstrings and your lower back. But if you would have completely shut it down, we would have stopped. Because I did. I asked you. I mean, I think I did okay with that with asking players what they thought. Yeah. But if you would have been like, nah, I'd been like. I just. I liked it. 1. I liked teaching it with you guys. I felt like it was. I felt like it was more team building than anything to get in the room together, get the phones away, to be able to get in the room for. For 40 minutes and check out with coach. Head coach with players. I felt like it was a really good team building deal. Just as much as the health benefits of rebalancing everything. [01:01:32] Speaker B: Yeah. And I think just like we talked about with the peak performance stuff, the guys that complained afterwards, you're like, damn, I feel good. Exactly right? It's like, that was a good reset of the body of the mind. Are you happier there doing it? Maybe not. But at the end of it, you see the benefits and you're like, oh, I feel really good. That was a long week of weights or. Yeah, that was a long week of games where that was a good reset for us. And yeah, the. The physical side of it. But just like that, the mental side of relaxation and going through that is something that our. We have a strength and conditioning coach here at Heartland who does do a lot of recovery stuff with the guys. He'll take them through yoga every now and then, but it's nothing. We don't do it weekly like we did at Western. [01:02:22] Speaker A: And that's probably just as good a way is taking the different mobility components, whether it's cats, cows, like there's those different mobility components in yoga that you could mix in and microdose within whatever workout you're doing. You don't have to do a full 40 minute yoga session. It's not necessary. But you can take those bits and pieces of the mobility part for rebalancing the shoulders and the hips. [01:02:46] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, no, definitely. And I think Lucas Cook, he's our strength and conditioning coach, he does a great job with them with that side of things and especially catchers. We have a separate program that we kind of do for them with the mobility stuff. But no, he does a great job implementing all those kind of things with them. [01:03:04] Speaker A: You have a fail forward moment. Everybody's got to answer this one. It's personally, professionally you got something you thought was going to set you back, but looking back now, it helped you move forward. [01:03:16] Speaker B: Well, I've gone through some personal things throughout my career in my time that weren't the best decisions that I made off the field and I'm comfortable talking about them and that those were eye openers of life. Right. And the fun part about my job here and as a success coach, I'm also a student success coach for the college here on campus. It's knowing that you're gonna make mistakes in life and it's about how you respond and it's honestly about having people in your corner to accept your failure and allow you to move on and grow from it and learn from it and build. And with my success coaching role that I talked about, even now, nowadays I work, work. It's basically baseball coaching to students. I, I work with traditional students who are 18 years old out of high school. I work with the 40 year old single mother of three who's trying to come back and get her college education and understanding that things come up, things happen. I, I failed at life in certain points of my life when I was younger especially and not having the right people around you, it could have derailed a lot of things. But having support from family, friends, coaches, all that kind of stuff to yes, it wasn't good when it happened, but but you learned from it, getting through it. And like I talked about with our guys, we want them to fail here. And levels of failure vary from what it is. And it can be serious, it can be, you miss a bus, it can be whatever it may be. But I want you to learn and be better from it. We, we do a thing here where we have a free pass, good, bad or ugly, where you get one mess up because that's how life goes. You're gonna screw up sometimes. Some guys use it earlier in the year, faster than others for that bus trip or missing a 5:30 weight session. But how many times after the free. [01:05:22] Speaker A: Pass do you have somebody that makes another mistake? [01:05:26] Speaker B: That individual person? Not rarely. Sometimes there's, there's other guys that do. But I, I would say the most disciplined teams and the best teams we ever had. Usually that sets the tone pretty quickly for what the expectation is. For example, something as simple as we were playing Mississauga Tigers from up in Ontario, they came down, some guys were in class. Well, two guys that were in class had the ball buckets. We didn't have balls for BP and they didn't communicate with each other. Hey man, I'm in charge of balls. We need to get the baseballs to the field. We ended up getting baseballs to the field, but we had a very fun practice the next day. And it's a learning moment of just simple communication stuff. I always think about the time in college and I use this story all the time with guys when we had, we had a fun bow and arrow day because some throw down bases weren't, weren't brought down to the field for outfield pickoffs. [01:06:30] Speaker A: And explain what a bow and arrow is to people that don't know. I know people are against conditioning, but I do feel like from an accountability standpoint and overall general fitness, I still think there's a time and a place for it. [01:06:43] Speaker B: Well, I knew you learn. Trust me, you learn. And that's one thing man you look at nowadays. It's like you got to be careful with some things. I get it. But you got to still be in good physical enough shape to handle a punishment. I'm a true believer. [01:06:57] Speaker A: By the way. There's a reason we didn't have a ton of arm injuries. [01:07:00] Speaker B: Yeah, no, 100%. So bow and arrows, you start, you run the warning track, you run sprint back to center field, all timed group sitting there doing usually leg tosses or planks or something. And I couldn't even tell you the number we got up to that day. But it's the accountability thing for me of all getting kids out of the mindset of somebody else will do it or somebody else will pick it up. It's like, well, if you know you need something done, you take accountability, you take control of the situation. You walk by that piece of garbage, pick it up. Oh well, somebody else will get it. That's not my job. It's not, whose is it right. It's not going to pick itself up. Simple, simple things like that that I try to instill in our guys. Of course again I think it goes back to some are born with it where it's, if you walk by something that's out of place, you walk by a chair that's not pushed into a table, you push it in other people. That's not my problem. I haven't done that. And it's getting everyone on the same page of what expectations are of just life and picking up each other, taking care of your teammates. If it was a freshman with the bucket, sophomores, we did the same thing last year. We had a practice where there were no buckets out here because they were in class. You guys went through this once, why didn't we learn from it? So guess what, we're going to learn from it again this time. [01:08:20] Speaker A: Love it. Have you added any evening or morning routines in? You're getting older, you're getting, you're, you're way behind me but you're getting older now. Have you added anything in evening or morning wise? [01:08:34] Speaker B: No, no I have not. And honestly with my day, it's busy. [01:08:42] Speaker A: I mean when's it start for you? When's it end your day? For people that don't know like I know it's, it's, I know it's hectic for you. So when's it start? When's it end? [01:08:49] Speaker B: Yeah. So with my jobs, I, I have a couple multiple other jobs that I do besides just coaching baseball here we practice at 8am every day. So, so for me it's, I'm up at 7 getting a breakfast, getting here to the field, getting the stadium set up, whatever's needed that day. And honestly 8am practices in the fall are great. It just opens up the day for getting everything else done. Our guys daily schedule, they have weights in the morning before that come out and that's three days a week. So they're not lifting every day but they come out to practice afterwards. Most have class from 11 to 2, 11 to 3, and it frees up their evenings to hang out, get the study tables, get homework done do whatever needs to be done for the day. And after that usually we get done around 10:30, 11 I come over to the office or if there's stuff that I have to do out at the corn crib. I'm the director of stadium operations out there now. So there's days where I'll be out there from 11 to 2 ish 2 o', clock, I'll come over here from 2 to 5 or so hopefully. Usually I'm getting better at preparing for lunch sometimes, sometimes it's just an uncrustable if that's what the day calls for. But. And then if I have lessons at night, so it'll be five or six to eight o' clock and then shut her down for the day. Obviously that's not every day for me and taking this new role. And lessons are obviously very seasonal as well of when more people want in. But it's, it's good man. And it's all. I'm much more successful in life when I'm busy and doing other things and it's all very meaningful to me. It's all stuff that I care about from even to be honest, the success coaching side of stuff with the. The students here at Heartland Community College, other JUCO coaches out there know you, you have other roles when you're at a college to help you get paid and make some money. And and I originally did it for that and I've grown to love it. You know, I work with students, I impact their lives with something as simple as hey mom and dad ain't gonna wake you up for college anymore. Guess what? You're on your own. Let's find a way to work on these time management strategies or connect them with resources on campus. We have a ton of resources here for all students when they go through things because like we talked about with the failures of baseball, some people have never failed in life, some people have never had a death in the family, some people have never had a traumatic experience and hopefully they never do. But that's not usually how life works and having people to help you and get through those moments has been very rewarding for me on a non baseball side of things. [01:11:42] Speaker A: How cool is that though? Because you can take your athletic coaching side and really throw that into the general population because I guarantee a majority of those people have never heard any of that stuff or been coached in any way. I think everybody needs a coach at some point. Even the general population needs a coach at some point. And how cool is that for you to be able to affect the General population, too. [01:12:05] Speaker B: Yeah, I think it's fun. I sometimes have to be mindful. [01:12:11] Speaker A: Of. [01:12:12] Speaker B: Of who I'm meeting with. Obviously, sometimes my success, coaching appointments with my players are a little different than. Than the average student. But the, the comparisons and, and everything that we talk. I talk about with students is comparable to stuff that I learned through baseball. It's something as simple as a time management strategy. This student struggling to find time to get homework done. As an athlete, we always had study tables, so that was never an issue. So it's creating a form of study tables. Tables for them. Whether they're coming here to sit outside of my office at a table and do some assignments, or setting up a time and accountability check in of. Hey, I'm at the library. Shoot me an email when you're at the library. I know you're there. Great. Different things like that, that athletes learn through sport, like you said, are beyond valuable to an everyday student. And just like athletes as well, they don't all listen. They. They don't all take the advice. And that's fine as long as we tried him and we tried to get him in the office and have a conversation. And if they don't want help, they don't want help. It's how everything works, right? [01:13:30] Speaker A: Congrats on the award, by the way. And by the way, I had nothing to do with it. People. People don't even know that you played for me for the most part. I found out after the fact. I was like, oh, good for Adam, man. That's awesome. But by the way, well deserved. You've been, I mean, you guys, a tremendous job. Heartland, I'm so proud of you and so happy for you, but I mean, what does this mean for you system? [01:13:50] Speaker B: No, it means a lot, man. Since I started coaching and obviously you being a big part of that, I knew how important and how special the ABCA is. It's been awesome going to the conventions, meeting different coaches, being being in the room with just great people. It means a lot. And I'm always. It's funny, I. I told my girlfriend, I told Courtney finally, and she. She goes, we were getting ready for bed, and I was like, oh, yeah. And by the way, I got an interview with Brownlee tomorrow. I won this award and she texted my family, and my mom said it perfectly. She's like, we're not great at bragging about ourselves. And I'm like, it's. It's hard for, for me and. But it is an honor. And it's a testament to the coaches that have came before me here, the coaches that have impacted my life, the coaches I'm currently coaching with and on. Obviously, the reason we all do it is the players and the guys that put us in this position to accept awards like this. I. Again, I'm not great at doing that and. But you deserve recognition, though. No, and I. I really appreciate it, man. It means a lot. [01:15:11] Speaker A: Thanks for your time. Appreciate you. Love you. I'll see you in Columbus. [01:15:14] Speaker B: Love you, too. Talk to you. [01:15:16] Speaker A: Always a moment of gratitude for me when one of my former players gets recognized. Adam was a pleasure to coach and so happy that he's doing well on his coaching journey. You can't say this about every player you coach, but Adam was one that you hoped would stand in the college coaching game. You knew he was going to make an impact on future players the right way. Congrats to Adam and the entire Heartland program on this honor. Thanks again to John Litchfield, Zach Hale, Matt west and the ABC office. For all the help on the podcast, feel free to reach out to me via email our brownleebca.org Twitter, Instagram or TikTok oachbabca or direct message me via the MyABCA app. This is Ryan Brownlee signing off for the American Baseball Coaches Association. Thanks. And leave it better for those behind. [01:16:00] Speaker B: You and you know that way Yep. [01:16:16] Speaker A: Wait for another day. [01:16:21] Speaker B: And the world will always return as your life Never for your name and you know that way Wait for another day Sam.