Ryne Romick - ABCA/Soldier Sports NCAA Div. III Assistant Coach of the Year, Denison University

[00:00:04] Speaker A: Welcome to the abca's podcast. I'm your host ryan brownlee. This episode is sponsored by Netting Pros. Netting Professionals are improving programs one facility at a time. Netting Professionals specializes in the design, fabrication and installation of custom netting for backstops, batting cages, dugouts, BP screens and ball carts. They also design and install digital graphic wall padding, windscreen, turf, turf protectors, dugout benches, dugout cubbies and more. Netting Professionals is an official partner of the ABCA and continues to provide quality products and services to many high school, college and professional fields, facilities and stadiums throughout the country. Netting Professionals are improving programs one facility at a time. Contact them today at 844-620-2707 or infoettingpros.com, visit them online at www.nettingpros.com or check out Netting Pros on Twitter, Instagram, Facebook and LinkedIn for all their latest products and projects. Make sure to let CEO Will Minor know that the ABCA sent you. Now on to the podcast. Next up on the ABCA podcast is ABCA Soldier Sports NCAA Division III Assistant Coach of the year Denison University's Ryan Romick Romick finished his 11th season on the Denison University coaching staff in 2026 and his sixth as associate head coach. Romick led Denison to a 513 record, their first national championship and a 3.14 team ERA coaching the pitchers. In 2025, Denison put together a remarkable 417 season, won its fifth straight NCAC regular season championship and sixth straight conference tournament title. He made program history by advancing the NCAA Division 3 World Series for the first time. Along the way, Romick helped develop a pitching staff to produce multiple All Americans and Conference award winners. That success didn't happen overnight. Romick has built an impressive coaching resume that includes stops at Denison, the University of Dayton and Ohio University at Dayton. He helped the Flyers produce their best ERA, walks and batting average against numbers since 2011, while his first stint at Denison included back to back NCAC West Division titles. Before becoming a coach, Ryan was a stand up pitcher at the University of Akron where he earned Pitcher of the Year honors as a senior after posting a 3.45 ERA and a.208 opponent batting average. Ro McLaid earned his Bachelor's degree in Biology from Akron and a Master's in Education from Ohio Valley. And after years of coaching, developing arms and competing at a high level, Romac brings a unique perspective on pitching development, player development, leadership and what it takes to build a consistently successful college baseball program. Let's welcome Ryan Romick to the podcast here at The Ryan Romick, ABCA Soldier Sports Division 3 Assistant Coach of the Year. Eleven seasons at Denison, first national championship with a 51, 3 record. Second stand at DU this time around. But was it Dayton, Ohio? Ohio Valley. But thanks for jumping on with me, Ryan. [00:03:28] Speaker B: Thanks for having me, man. [00:03:30] Speaker A: You know, congrats to you guys. But not only in baseball. I read you guys had other championships on campus too this year. So congrats to Denison athletic department. [00:03:40] Speaker B: Yeah, phenomenal year for, for the athletic department. Some men's swim and dive, women's basketball just dominated their run. And then doubles tennis too. [00:03:50] Speaker A: Yep. [00:03:51] Speaker B: So had a few of them. [00:03:52] Speaker A: How stressful was it at the end for you guys with the championship series because it was so wild. [00:03:58] Speaker B: Yeah, it felt like probably not just in the World Series, but for the last probably month and a half of the season we didn't stop playing one run games. So we went like a month during the year for a while there, not playing close games and we were winning and not necessarily playing great, but we were winning and winning easily. And then all of a sudden it was like, all right, we, I think it started with probably the DePaul Little Series in the middle of the year and then it was like one run game, one run game. Come from behind, come from behind. So. And then we walk off three times in a regional, which is insane. Three straight walk offs, go to the super play a couple really good games with Piedmont, and then the World Series, you lose the first one, then you're just backs against the wall for the whole time you're there. So never stops. Really. [00:04:42] Speaker A: How did your guys handle that? Because you really, I mean you've been winning games. They were close, but you obviously were winning. And how did you guys handle that? Because that was abnormal for you guys, especially with only losing three games all year. [00:04:54] Speaker B: Yeah, we used to call ourselves Coach Deegan would always say we're the best bounce back team in the country. And we went like, I think you could go back and look, but I think we had lost like back to back games maybe once or twice in the last five years, which is a crazy thing. So we would always say that we're the best bounce back team in the country. You lose a game. We would just start saying it to each other, we'll come back, back. And so the guy started saying that as soon as we walked in the locker room after that loss, which was kind of cool because we won 44 straight and then we lose first game of the World Series. I Go. No. And then they started saying that. And I think Coach Deegan sent a couple guys the. The Kevin Millar viral clip with him and Dan Shaughnessy, right? And he's saying, why don't you take it back for calling us choke artists or whatever. And he's like, don't let us win this one then. So then the guys come in. The next morning, we play at 10am, 7am, we're taking BP and guys are walking around. Max Fishbein and Noah are walking around the locker room just saying, they better not let us win this one. If they let us get a nap today, we're. They're in trouble. So it was. It was a cool little, like, rallying cry that they started to kind of to go together. [00:06:00] Speaker A: Were you able to keep the arms healthy for the most part all year? [00:06:05] Speaker B: Yeah, somewhat. You know, we came into the year with a couple guys, so we had a fresh. We had two freshmen come in that had TJ in high school. So those were, you know, you kind of never know how that's going to go. And one of them, I think, was a little bit far along. Devin Parker was a little farther along than Andrew Montero. So Monty kind of started real slow, and then Robbie Lee was the same way. He had TJ's the Summer of his junior year or summer going into his junior year, so he missed his whole junior season. And so last year he kind of got off to a slow start because he wasn't quite ready yet. So we kind of dealt with that kind of getting guys going. And then Montero gets a blood clot and is. He ends up with thoracic outlet syndrome. He gets a blood clot in his bicep and his shoulder during the regional. So he was 20 minutes from starting. His arm turns blue. Never really seen that before. And he was. He was unbelievable. He's an unbelievable pitcher. He's going to be really good, but he's a freshman Lefty, you know, 92, 94 or something like that. But so we lose him for the rest of the season. So to still be able to kind of do it and lose one of your better arms there that late was. Was tough. But, yeah, for the most part, I would say we stayed, you know, somewhat healthy. [00:07:19] Speaker A: You had 20 pitchers make appearance during the year. [00:07:22] Speaker B: Yep. [00:07:23] Speaker A: Is that by design? [00:07:25] Speaker B: That was everybody. So everybody appeared and yeah, somewhat by design that everybody appeared. But, yeah, we had a good. We had a good group. There was, you know, our scrimmages were pretty solid in midweeks, and Stu, when we had after squads, you know, guys are, you know, throwing mid-80s and, and throwing strikes, but kind of still behind guys. And that's, you know, testament to the depth of the program. And. And guys still buying into a role. Like they knew that that's what they needed to do to help us win was so guys can get at bats, they can continue to get better. So those aren't kind of meaningless little inner squad outings like, no, this matters. And you're trying to get better. We're trying to fix stuff. So. But yeah, by design, I guess. Yeah. That everybody appeared in the game and [00:08:07] Speaker A: 3.13 ERA, so obviously it worked. [00:08:10] Speaker B: Yeah. Yeah. I mean, to be honest with you, we just didn't know. We didn't know where to go pitching wise. When the year started, we really had one. One big returner coming back. And so we'd lost three guys. We lost a really good senior, he's with the Padres, a couple other seniors that were really solid pieces for us. And then we lose three guys in the portal. So we lost one guy to Tulane, one guy to Pit, and one guy to Duke. So there was a lot of, you know, 75, 80 of our innings are out the door. And now it's like you, you know, when people would ask me, I was like, I really don't know. Like, we have to figure this out. And, and the good thing is, I tell people is like, we won while we were figuring it out. And that usually doesn't work that way. Right. It's usually you kind of throw things at the wall, see what sticks and it doesn't work. And you're like, well, that guy can't do that. But it's. But we were making. We made, luckily made decent decisions. [00:09:01] Speaker A: So you have any tips for, like, the guys are maybe getting an inning here and there. How are you keeping those guys sharp? [00:09:08] Speaker B: Again? Like, every week was kind of the same for those guys. And you know, our guys that are just through six innings are now bullpening on Wednesday and these guys are throwing live on Wednesday and they're. And they're after it. That's their day to compete. It's their big day. So. And those things are all monitored. We're get. We have trackman data and they're getting their video, so they're getting the same treatment. It's just one of them is getting stats on the Internet and the other one's not right. And so it all still matters. And for us, I think that's probably something that we do a decent job of, is guys Understand that those Tuesday practices and those Wednesday practices and Thursday, they really matter. Like, you got to go out there and perform because it's a performative business, right? So it's like, if you can't go out there and get a job done, get people out, you're not going to pitch on Saturday. Like, if you can go out there and do it Tuesday and then do it next Tuesday and do it next Tuesday, you'll get the ball on Saturday at some point and we'll see if it works. [00:10:01] Speaker A: How have you enjoyed trackman data? [00:10:04] Speaker B: I love it for multitude of reasons, right. But the feedback loop gets so much shorter, right. And it takes away a lot of guesswork. And I would say, you know, it also helps with the transparency between players. It's like, okay, like, my stuff is this stuff and this pitch is a really good pitch and this pitch is not a good pitch and there's really not a whole lot of guesswork. And then sometimes you, you learn like, the trackman's not everything because some guys have a ton of deception and hide the ball well. And now that you can't really, you know, calculate that, I'm sure somebody has at some point, but, you know, so they hide the ball well. Maybe it says their fastball stinks, but now they're out here and they're getting swings and misses with the heater in the zone. So. But yeah, I would say it's, it's shortened the feedback loop for guys because now and then, you know, you. I heard Rory McElroy saying this. I think Deke sent it to me, but it was a great quote. And he was asking about guys being kind of Ranger Ricks and staring at the trackman and not being a real golfer. Right. And he said, I think you have to apply it to give yourself more feelings. So you use that data to create better feel for what the ball is doing instead of just relying on the screen and the numbers. It's, oh, that's a good two seam. That's what it feels like. Okay. Now when I'm in a game, I know how to recreate that pitch and correct it if it gets bad. And then when I do this and my slot drops here and I start to get underneath the ball a little bit and it carries. Now I know what that feels like as well. So you're creating like a sense of feel for guys who maybe don't have great, you know, ability to adapt when they first get there. [00:11:44] Speaker A: Coach Deegan said you're a really good evaluator. [00:11:49] Speaker B: I don't Know, if I am, I think. I think I'm really willing to admit that. I think it's a bit of a crapshoot. Because what I mean by that is he proved this point to me a while. He was like, you can't. It's really tough to figure out if it's really going to matter to someone and continue to matter. So, like, you see a guy and you love the arm stroke and. And you see the ball come out of his hand pure and. And everything's right, right? Like, the front side's good. And he's got good, good. He's good ability, stay in the ground. He rotates really fast and all this stuff, right? And it's. Everything checks the box and then you're like, he doesn't really like baseball. It's like he's gonna get. He's gonna get crushed by someone with average mechanics and a great work ethic. He just is like. And that happens so often. So while it's. I think you watch enough and you see enough and you've done it long enough too, where you watch guys throwing, you're like, yeah, that's going to work. That's got a chance. I think there's an easy. Some of those are easy to check off. Like, that's going to work, but you don't know if it's actually going to work and, like, continue to work. So that part's tough, I think. [00:12:59] Speaker A: Do you feel like it's the biggest X factor is how they handle campus life and. And all the things that come with playing college baseball? [00:13:06] Speaker B: I think it's that and then the game, right? Like, how do you handle a game? So many people beat themselves up way too hard. And some people have this, like, foggy sense of reality where they think they're better than they are or they think they're worse than they are, and both of those are equally as bad. And so I just try to be like a real big truth teller and just say, like, you don't stink, but this is what it is. Like, you threw like this, and this pitch stunk, and this was a bad decision, and this was a bad miss, and this was a good miss. And. And so you just try to be really transparent and honest, and hopefully through that they begin to learn who they are, like an honest version of themselves. And that's like, I always tell people, like, you're not done. You're going to grow, you're going to keep getting better, but you have to have an honest version of who you are so we can work from there. [00:13:57] Speaker A: What has Coach Deegan meant to you? Everything. [00:14:01] Speaker B: Yeah, he's. He's. He's been, you know, one of my better friends for a while now, and. And especially in this game, he's someone you can always bounce ideas off of. He's a great listener. He's also, like, has this uncanny ability to always kind of check you with, not check without really checking you. And he asks good questions in that way. So, you know, and. And I. I pride myself on trying to be a good assistant coach. So I'm always, like, watching what is he seeing and trying to catch it before he does. You know, you do those things, it's almost like being around, watching your kid and trying to pick up something before he trips over it or whatever. But you do a lot of that, so he's meant a lot, and he's just changed the way I thought about baseball. He's always kind of. He's always looking at the next thing and trying to challenge for the next thing. And for, you know, for me and Danny will sit here sometimes and be like, God, we just figured out how to do it, like, and now we gotta break it and fix it again. You know what I mean? So. But that's. That's how you keep getting better. So, yeah, he's. He's awesome. Great person to work for. Unreal. Human, you know, great dad, good husband. He would tell you he's not either of those things, but. But he is. [00:15:11] Speaker A: What is your definition of a good assistant? [00:15:16] Speaker B: Just that, like a. I think a high level of awareness is required. You obviously have to work hard and be smart and try to be at the top of your game and all those things. Right. But, like, what makes a really good assistant? I think it's trying to be able to diagnose issues, have a good level of filter, like what makes it to Coach Deegan and what doesn't make it to Coach Deegan and what can get stopped before it does. But if you're completely unaware and you're just either at practice or on the road, and you can kind of sense something coming along, and you just sit there and watch it happen, and then he's got to blow up and you could have stopped it all, I think you can really, like, keep the energy and calmness about the ship before it needs to blow up, and if he catches stuff, then he's going to have to lose it. Right. And. And things like that. So I think you're constantly trying to do that, you know, at practice, I'm constantly looking at, like, how Are we moving? Is this set up? Is this ready to go? And you know, if it's not and this. All of us do that. It's a small school, so we don't have managers out there sitting stuff up. But you're trying to catch stuff and see stuff kind of moving before it does. [00:16:27] Speaker A: Going to Dayton, Ohio, what'd you learn going there and then coming back? Because you don't always see that, where assistants come back to where they're at. [00:16:35] Speaker B: Yeah, I think first I learned I didn't know as much as I thought I did. That'd be first. And the other part is it was just different. Right. So, you know, I went from a Division 3 school, recruiting, to now like running the books and recruiting with 11 scholarships at Dayton. And I had no idea what I was doing trying to balance the scholarship spreadsheet and look out over the next three years and what are we going to do with this half a scholarship in two years or whatever. I had no idea what I was doing. It's way over my head there. And then, you know, from the pitching standpoint of things, I was. I was pretty early on in the. In the driveline and velo development movement and I was kind of running with it and we were doing well here. And then I got there and. And my ego took a big hit because we actually pitched pretty well my first year there. And I didn't do any of that. I was just trying to get a better pitching staff. Throw the ball in the zone more, don't walk as many people. And we were. We were fine. We were not great, but we were fine. But we were. We had a pile of guys at like 84, 86, 87. And I just left Denison and we had like five 90 mile an hour guys. And I was like, this stinks. I can't have a bunch of guys throwing 84, 86. So what did I do? I blew it up. And I tried to make people throw really hard and they stopped throwing strikes. So yeah, so I cheated one to get the other and it didn't really work out for me. So I just learned a lot there. I failed a lot. I learned a lot. And then I was working for a different personality. Tony V's. He's an Italian, he's loud, he yells a lot. Funny guy, but yells a lot. So there's just two different personalities. So working with that, I get to see that. And then I leave in and go to Ohio and then you work for Rob and that's another different bird. So you learn a lot. [00:18:25] Speaker A: How do you balance that as a pitching coach? Because obviously velocity does matter, but command also matters too. So how do you help that in the development process of, you know, because I think in the old days we just assumed that guys eventually, through weight room and, and work and that and proper nutrition, they're going to eventually throw harder. So how do you balance that as a pitching coach? I think that's a really hard balancing act of yes, velocity does matter, but command also matters too. [00:18:52] Speaker B: Yeah, 100% velocity definitely matters. You know, as what we tell guys here is, is look, the, the farther we play, the longer we play, the strike zone gets smaller. And now it's much more like a Division 1 zone now with ABs where they're. It's the white of the plate, right? You're not getting the edges. So can. Is your stuff good enough to get out over the white? Not, not these edges and chalk strike calls that we get sometimes in the midweeks or whatever, but it's. Can you throw the ball through the middle 17 inches and see what happens? So velocity really does matter. I think now it's. And I don't think you're very far off with what you said. It's, it's, it's this holistic approach to it, right? It's not, it's not like, can we change the way you leverage your body to get you to carnival throw towards this, this fence and do a pull down and now all of a sudden you throw harder. That's great. But you, your body doesn't move well. You know, you're not sequencing well. You don't know how the ball's coming out of your hand and you don't know where it's going. So now it's, it's this holistic approach to try to get this guy better move down the mound more efficiently and hopefully, you know, weight room down there get a lot stronger. So we use force plates now and, and velocity based testing in the weight room. So we have some good avenues to improve the way guys move and how explosive they can be. So now it's like, okay, now we have this baseline of strength to work off of. How can we get you more explosive and what can we do on the mound? On my side of things, it's using this kind of team approach to it. [00:20:24] Speaker A: How often are you guys on the force plates? [00:20:27] Speaker B: So we go twice a week in the spring. In the fall, it's usually once a week, maybe once every other week. But in the springtime it's massive for us because we're just trying to one monitor recovery and make sure our guys are where they're supposed to be. Or actually our first baseman that graduated last year, he and a team of I think two or three other students built this, this portal for us now. So I can go online, I can type in one of our guys names and I can see his jumps throughout the spring and see where if he's trending up, is he kind of staying plateaued or what's he doing? And the same goes for, you know, guys that aren't throwing as much like we talked about that are in those midweeks, you're still tracking their jumps like you need to get stronger, we got to move faster. So. But another, another kind of data point where you can go back to guys and go, you're here, you need to be here. What do we need to do to change it? [00:21:16] Speaker A: Yeah, how do you adjust that? Say a guy's plateaued on that. What kind of tweaks do you guys make for them? [00:21:22] Speaker B: That's all John, our strength coach. So he'll come back sometimes and be like one, like okay, if a guy starts two deviations down for the last two weeks or whatever it's hey, we're going to adjust the lift. You need to adjust his practice plan. Like if he's on the plan to play first base today, maybe he dhs, maybe he sits out bp, whatever it is, we got to get them back, right? But a lot of times it's just conversation. You know, it's, it's word Denison. It's very tough here academically. So you may have a week where a guy has three exams and, and two papers due and he's not sleeping. So all of a sudden he jumps and you might start thinking you need to change the lift and change practice and he's like, coach, I haven't slept in four days. It's like, okay, now I, you know, that's the problem. It's not, you know, it's something small typically is what the issue is or you know, it's anything pet dies, you know, problems at home, whatever it is, those issues creep up on that force plate. And then it's like a no BS meter. It's like, no, you're not doing good right now. Like we got to fix this. [00:22:22] Speaker A: So awesome way to open up lines of communication with your players. Yeah, yeah, a little bit like track man. It's like, okay, the data doesn't lie. Like what's going on? And you have to be honest with what's going on. Something's changed with, with your screen or whatever it is. I think it's a great way to open up lines of communication. [00:22:39] Speaker B: Yeah. Yeah. It's a very, it's very easy way to get honest dancers because there is no like, you know, we always say you can't fake the jumps. Like get in there and go to work. Like you can't fake it. So go. You can fake a practice, you can fake catch play or whatever, but can't fake that. So it says you're down, you're down. [00:22:55] Speaker A: Do you have an admissions cut off, Denison? Because I think about you guys with the transfer portal. Obviously you. You lose some guys and if you have an emissions cut off, it's not, it's not like you place those guys. [00:23:08] Speaker B: Yeah. So the transfers like getting a transfer in here a little different than the normal admissions deadline. So the normal one is November 15th is ED1. We have the early decision period. So ED1, November 15th, January 15th is ED2. So. But for transfers, you know, we can get somebody throughout the summer if we wanted to and. And get them in being a transfer, not an incoming freshman, if it was an incoming stud, probably wouldn't be able to do it. [00:23:36] Speaker A: One of my visits out of high school is Denison by the way. Nice February visit. I had no idea if I was going to be good enough to play Division 1 baseball. So back in the old where seniors took visits, I'm sure you guys probably still do that. But yeah, I had applied and then I visited so it's awesome. [00:23:55] Speaker B: Great campus. [00:23:56] Speaker A: Beautiful campus. [00:23:57] Speaker B: February visit, you were probably bundled up there. [00:24:01] Speaker A: Well, you're used to it in the Midwest so. [00:24:03] Speaker B: Yeah, it's true. [00:24:04] Speaker A: I did kind of a duel. I didn't apply to Ohio State but I had friends there. So I went to Ohio State for a little bit just to hang out and then came over. Yeah, my Denison visit. 2. Two opposite ends of the spectrum on schools size wise. [00:24:18] Speaker B: No doubt, no doubt. I don't know how many there are at Ohio State anymore. 50. [00:24:22] Speaker A: 50. [00:24:22] Speaker B: 40 something. [00:24:23] Speaker A: Too much. [00:24:24] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:24:25] Speaker A: Obviously the size of that school is way more in my sweet spot than something at a bigger school institution. So you know, were you. Do you feel like you were delayed at all recruiting wise because you guys played for so long or does it. Does it really go into it at all? [00:24:42] Speaker B: Yeah, I mean for sure. I think that. And then the hangover of like. I. Yeah, I. I had to like re. Watch games because I didn't remember being there. So. Yeah, it was just crazy. Yeah, definitely. I, we. I was actually Talking to coach Deegan about this the other day, I said, you know Pete, like I think it's football players or like NFL teams or whatever would say like when they, when you make a deeper on the playoffs like you don't realize how short your off seasons get. And so the last two years going the World Series, it feels like summer's half over when you start it. You know you're like into July before you. If you just take a little breather and you look up it's like July 13th and you're like holy cow, what happened this summer. So yeah, it has been, it has been a little interesting last two years but I think we're doing okay. And again as you mentioned the recruiting piece of it, it's gone. It's gone heavier towards like where our relationships at and, and less of the mass marketing and running around with your. With your head cut off trying to find a game or a guy. It's like okay, we know this guy's over here because so and so called us and said hey, this is a good fit for you. Come over and watch. So that, that's super helpful. [00:25:53] Speaker A: What is a good fit for Denison? If you check off all the boxes, what's a good fit at Denison? [00:26:01] Speaker B: I think you, you, you have to want the education part of it. You have to because you're going to be challenged there. And it's not easy. In the spring when we're traveling around and missing classes and things like that, it's just not, it's not easy. But our guys always find a way to kind of make it work. As you know, probably it's like your best students, you don't hear anything about them. You only hear stuff about the worst ones that don't go to class or forget a homework or something. So. But good students don't have an issue with it. But one, they have to want that challenge and then two, like they have to understand that it's a, it's a really competitive program and we're gonna, we always say like we're gonna try to win a national championship and then now we can say we did win a national championship. But that's what we're, that's what our goal is. Which means it's going to be a really high standard. You're going to get coached really hard. And Diggs is Kaizen never continues to never ending improvement deal. Like it's real. So when you do something well it doesn't mean we're going to like continually pat you on the back for Two weeks, like we're going to go to the next thing and try to fix it. So sometimes that feels, I think like guys are, feel like they're getting picked on or, or it's nitpicking or whatever. It's not, it's just, that's just how we're wired. So you know, if you, you come out and you throw, you know, three innings and strike, you strike out five and you walk one and you hit a guy on another two, like we're going to talk about the O2 hit by pitch. Like it's going to happen and, and you're going to be like, but I threw three scoreless. Like what are you doing? And so it, that's just how it goes. So I think those, those types of wired people where it's like, no, I really want to be coached. Like I have no issue about it. Like it is not personal. Just take it and go. Those people have a lot of success here. And, and you have to be a self starter because it's Division 3, right. We, we are not with you. We're not hand holding you out the field. We, we practice three days a week in the fall. So what are you doing? The other four, like a lot of guys are at the park, they're just out there hitting. They're out there taking ground balls, but we're not out there. So if you can't do it on your own and get out of bed and go, then you're not going to make it. People will pass you because they're going to be out there. [00:28:07] Speaker A: I think that's a good example though of kids will learn how to make adjustments on their own because they are finding self mastery. [00:28:14] Speaker B: Yes. [00:28:14] Speaker A: Because they're going to have to work on their own so that they're not going to have a coach in their ear the entire time. So I think it does allow kids to have some freedom to be able to make adjustments. They learn quicker that way. [00:28:25] Speaker B: Yeah, you're 100% right. I think, I think in my role now more is like can, can I, can I show them what a good routine looks like and show them how to make adjustments to it? Can I teach them how to like journal so that they can write down stuff after bullpens and look at it and know what to fix and know what to, you know, take videos on their phone and just show them how to do stuff, not overly coach it. And then they come up to me. A lot of times they're like, hey, I'd like to add this to catch play. What do you think about that? I'm like, yes, it's good. Let's do it. Let's try it. Way more of that kind of a. Like, I would say if you feel much more. If you feel like you're sitting in the passenger seat, you're way too close to the driver. Like, be a spotter, like, up on the track, right? And like, hey, you got a car behind you. Whatever. If you're sitting in the pasture, you're in the car, you're way too close to the guy. So just leave them alone. And they'll get way better at driving. [00:29:19] Speaker A: You go through the journals with them if they want. [00:29:23] Speaker B: I try not to. The kid who transferred to Duke, he'll call me and be like, I have an entry in my journal from March 22nd or whatever. And I'm like, he's. He's way, way gone. But other guys. Sometimes guys will. I'll be like, hey, well, what did. What did we say when we were talking about this? And so then they'll go back and they'll go like, oh, well, you said, try this. I'm like, did it work? I don't know if it worked. Like, you'd have to tell me if it worked, but things like that. So I think. [00:29:53] Speaker A: And. [00:29:53] Speaker B: And look, I'm not. I don't force guys to. But some guys are like, that's just how they were. They're wired, they're very thoughtful. They like to write things down, they like to read. So it's like, okay, well then journal stuff. And other guys don't like to do anything, and that's fine too. But for some guys, it's really helpful because I think they. They forget twice as much as they. They actually have been told, so they can go back and look at it and kind of figure out what's going on. [00:30:20] Speaker A: How do you handle one guys leave? I mean, obviously some of it's probably grad transfer stuff. Yeah. But you invest all that time and. And it does hurt. You know, Obviously, kids want to go to situations, but you guys have a great situation there. So obvious it's gonna sting a little bit. How do you handle that conversation with kids? Because you just said you still talk to the kid that's at Duke. [00:30:40] Speaker B: Yeah. So, yeah. So I think every situation is a little different, and how you handle it's, you know, different and unique. So none of those three were, like, bad situations, them leaving? I didn't have any ill will towards any of them. I did, like, the timing of it was weird, but also it was New for us. We never had anybody leave. So we still haven't had anybody leave other than those three, other than the grad transfer. So Denison, we don't have grad school. So we've had, you know, guys play it. William and Mary and western Kentucky and UMass and a few other places, Maryland. So we've had those kids from this year is actually going to Virginia for a grad year. So we'll pitch there. But yeah, I think every situation is unique and, and you know, the relationships are typically pretty good. Like I said, it's very transparent. So you kind of know where they stand and stuff like that. You hope that they can come to you because this is probably not an easy situation for them either. So look, I think I'm willing to admit like Denison is not a cheap place to go to school and if someone is out there throwing money at you and a free education or something, I understand needing to talk about it, you know what I mean? But I also think it's like kind of ridiculous. All the back end channeling that goes through right now. It's nuts. And it's like even this past year there's all kinds of people talking to people and texting me and they're, they're like third on the telephone list of people and they're like, hey, I heard so and so is that talk asking about so and so. I'm like, come on, man. Like, you know, one, like I, that's people that, you know, just pick up the phone and call me and I'll tell you, like he's, you know, so and so is not in the portal. So and so is not in the portal. And if they were in the portal and you called me, I would talk to you about them just like I did those three guys. So I think for some people it's, it's, it can be a shady business, it can, but it doesn't, it doesn't need to be. That's my point. I don't think it needs to be because the kids aren't, kids aren't doing it like in a malicious sense or anything. They're like, it's just a real thing. Like now it's, it's available. [00:32:51] Speaker A: So standard size roster for you guys, is it around 50? Do you try to keep around 50? [00:32:56] Speaker B: Yeah, so we try to keep it under 50. It's, it's usually 45, something like that. So I think we had 46 last year. I think we'll have 44 going in this fall, which is like I would Say, it's probably a little bigger than we like, but usually we. So we used to have this, like, a little bit of attrition, right? You bring in 10 to 12 every year, and then you'd end up with a little bit of attrition because, you know, some guy finds a Fortune 500 company, he had an internship, and he wants to work there, and he knows he wants to work there, and that's what he wants to do. We've had other guys that are entrepreneurs that started their own businesses, and they were like, baseball's kind of taking up too much of my time, understand? And sometimes, like we talked about before, they just don't love baseball anymore. And it's still really hard. We're not slowing down to, like, hold this guy's hand. We're moving. So if you make that decision, that's a good decision to make. Like, hey, I can't do this anymore. That's fine. We used to have that, and now we don't. We graduated 12 seniors last year. I think we'll have, like, 11 this year. So that attrition has kind of stopped. So now we're bringing in 10 to 12, and we're keeping 10 to 12. So the roster's just gotten naturally, just a little bit bigger. But no, you know, the struggle with that is, like, how do you keep everybody happy? But I don't think we have too much trouble with that, to be honest with you. [00:34:14] Speaker A: How's your throwing program evolved over time? Has it tweaked at all? You know, how you're laying it out for guys? Have you evolved it much? [00:34:22] Speaker B: It's. It's definitely tweaked. I think Rob probably affected it maybe the most, and he was a big proponent of, like, as the pitching coach. Stop worrying about the little nuts and bolts and worry way more about the, like, the macro programming of, like, winner guys build up, and when are they throwing during the week? What are they doing on. On day two and day three and day four and less about what are we doing during catch play. So. And while that still matters, it really does, but, like, playing good catch really matters, but I think some people, you know, put the cart before the horse, and they're not worried about what's going on. And then guys. Guys are throwing heavy day, heavy day, heavy day. They do, like, five of them in a week, and then they're sore and they can't throw on Tuesday. So I. I started focusing a lot more on that and. And how much we're throwing and that it's okay. To take some really low intent days where you're doing some ground based stuff and you're really not throwing a ball a whole lot. So those are, I would say, some of the things. And then we've just, I think we've moved way more into way more of an athletic type of throwing stuff. So it's a lot less stationary stuff a lot. You know, I don't have anybody throwing on a knee anymore or doing wrist flips or whatever. It's, you know, it's a lot of the pre work. You know, there's. Now we've got it to where. And if you ask coach Deegan, he's like, all they do is foam roll down there. All the pitchers do his foam roll. So. But there's a good like 15 minute segment where they're just doing pre throw stuff. And, and if I always tell people if you came and watched us, you would say there is like, there is zero program because everybody's doing different stuff. Like, we got guys that love plyos, we got guys that hate plyos. We got guys that use crossover symmetry bands. We have guys who use J bands. They have to do some sort of band workout. And then we got guys doing hip 9090s. We got guys doing PVC pipe drills on the mound. We got another guy wearing a corvillo belt doing med ball work. Like, there's stuff going all over the place. But again, I think my thing is like, try to help them understand what a good routine is, but not give them all the nuts and bolts of it. Like, you like the corvillo belt, go do it. You like you're, you have hip issues, then go get the hips loose. Like you, you like to roll out on the wall. Cool. Go do that. Like or giving you 15 minutes to get your, your body ready to throw. But it looks kind of haphazard if you came and watched this. [00:36:48] Speaker A: They do a dynamic warm up too. [00:36:50] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:36:51] Speaker A: So they do it at 15 minutes. [00:36:53] Speaker B: Yeah. Dyno with the team. And then they're in the bullpen for 15, 10 to 15. [00:36:57] Speaker A: I still. And then they're getting the body loose before you do all that stuff is the best way. [00:37:01] Speaker B: Yeah. Then there's, there's some days that, that I, that I take it away from without telling them I'm taking away from. Which it always. That's a fun day. Which is like, grab a ball, grab a partner, let's go. And they're like, but. And I'm like, you don't need it. It's fine. I promise you're gonna be okay. Like, when you were 12, you used to do this all the time. You used to get out of the car after driving two hours, still throw. So just to prove that they don't. It's not a crutch. You don't need to go do pliers, and you don't need to do it perfectly. So we'll just get a partner in the ball, and we'll go play defensive catch, and we'll play quick catch and just have fun with it. And they tend to not break. [00:37:34] Speaker A: So when did you add that in? [00:37:38] Speaker B: Well, we used to do it. I did it out of necessity the first few times, because Diggs would be like, I want to do. I want to do a bunch scrimmage, but pitchers take too long to get ready, and I want to do it right away. And I was like, let's just do it. I'll just get the pitchers, play catch for the shortstop, the infielders, and let's go. And so the guys freaked out. And I was like, because they freaked out, I'm like, I'm. I'm gonna keep that in the bag. That's coming out, like, once every three, four weeks. And you just kick them out there and say, go ahead and go. And you'll see guys that are like, like. And I'm like, come on, man, you're fine. Like, your arm's good. Just throw. So it's really funny. [00:38:15] Speaker A: What about tweaks with bullpen routines? Have you tweaked much over the years? Kind of the same deal, I would say. Guys. [00:38:23] Speaker B: No, I think they've. They've added. We've added a lot of layers. I. I actually started doing, like, a few little. I've picked up just, like, a little one here and a little one there that I. That I enjoy. Like, some. Some recall bullpens are really fun. Like, if you. If you think your bullpens, like, lack a little bit of focus, recall bullpens, where catchers call pitches and then you just hand them the chart at the end and script out the whole bullpen. But you already have it scripted so you knew what they threw. So you give the script to the catcher, you stand there and watch it, and then give the blank paper to the pitcher, have them recall 20 pitches. Where'd you throw them? Were they balls or strikes? What pitch was it? Those are fun. I think anytime a little bit of competition between a couple guys is fun. So we'll do, like, horse and. And cat and those things. But a lot of times, once we get to, to like the spring, it becomes way more about, you know, and in the fall, as we, as we move into the fall, it's way more about like what's the gap that needs filled and what are we working on. So our guys will come in here, they'll meet for every time they throw live. They meet with me and Coach Marsh, they'll meet with me for 15, 20 minutes in groups of two or three. We go over their, you know, their, their, their sheets from the day before, which is like, you know, counts. Nasty and put away, those are our three categories. So maybe stole from Blue Jays guy, but counts. So how you dominate in the strike zone. First pitch, strikes, first two or three, all those things, right? Nasty, that's swinging, miss, that's swinging strikes, that's whiff and zone, that's called strikes plus whiff. What's that those percentages look like? And then the put away is how often you get to two strikes and how often do you get the K. And realistically, as the fall goes on, you're probably either like good at one, good at the other, or you're good at two and not good at the other. And it kind of just lets you know who you are and what you need to work on. So we'll come in here, we talk about the sheets and we go through all the numbers, go through your bats, we look at trackman data, we look at video, and then when they come out for their next bullpen, it's really not a, hey, coach, what would you like me to do? They already know what they're coming to the field for. Like, oh, I threw, I'm still a 51% strike thrower, but my stuff is really good. Like how can I get in the zone more? Or it's the other way around. That's I'm 78% strikes. I have no swing and miss stuff and I don't have a single strikeout, but I got the two strikes like seven times. It's like, okay, we need to develop like a pretty good outlier pitcher so we can get a strikeout. And then you know why you're good and you know what you need to work on. [00:41:10] Speaker A: How are you working in pitch development then when you're tweaking with guys pitch [00:41:13] Speaker B: pitches so that, that's, you got the portable trackman, just run it down the bullpen. And so this guy may be doing a complete command pin and this guy over here may be doing all pitch design on his change up to try to get some depth out of it. Or whatever, right? So again, once, once the fall gets going and we're in the thick of it and same thing in the spring, middle of spring, it may be, these two guys are doing diamond bullpens and trying to work the ball around the zone. This guy's doing east, west, this guy's doing north, south, pen, and this guy is doing north. All slider development. This guy's doing all curveball development. And, and so these guys don't need the trackman, but this guy does. And, and so that's kind of how it flows. [00:41:54] Speaker A: Besides journaling, what other peak performance stuff are you helping guys with? Anything? [00:42:00] Speaker B: I don't think anything. I, I, I'm, I'm more of a conversationalist than anything, than any little, little nuts and bolts. So I like talking to guys. I like when guys open up a talk so that these, the meetings are honestly some of the best. I would say if you're, if you're not doing them, do them. I always tell people I think it's, it's like a low hanging fruit that really doesn't take much time, which gives you a way closer relationship with your pitchers. And the stuff that they'll say in there sometimes is stuff you had no idea that they thought about. And you're just like, oh, you think that with your slider, like, no wonder we got issues. Or you think that with your heater, like, and so sometimes things pop up in there and you're just like, I'm gonna file that away because I need that information for later and that'll help. And you just get different perspective. Sometimes you realize you're sitting there in a bullpen and you know, I know you've been there. You just are fighting in one direction and this guy is, and you're like, this is the most uncoachable guy that I've ever coached in my life. He's an idiot. He doesn't get it. And then you realize like one little like, conversation, you're like, oh, it, it was never going to work the way I was trying to get it to work. You know, it's a square, square, square and around round hole. [00:43:14] Speaker A: How much info are you guys sharing on scouting reports? [00:43:18] Speaker B: Almost none. [00:43:19] Speaker A: Love it. [00:43:20] Speaker B: Almost none. Now it's, it's guy to guy. So again, the journal guy that's at Duke, I, I told him that this is what I did with them. So I've had, I have a few guys and we have a couple, we had a couple guys that just graduated that were scouting report guys that wanted information. I Always say, I'll give you as much as you want. You tell me. And so the guy from Duke, he would, he would get on, he would be in this, this, this. And I go, how about this? I'll tell you how to do it. So I did a whole class for all of our pitchers. I was like, here's how I do scouting reports. Here's what I look for. Here's the process that I go through, looking at hitters. Here's how I do positioning charts. This is where I put guys on the field. This is why I do it. Here's. And I do it the same every time. I have a little notebook, it's still got all the teams that we've, we've played and, and a whole bunch of scouts and, and so it's a whole bunch of positioning charts. You know, Hanover positioning from two years ago. This is two years ago thing. So it's the same notebook or doing the same, same way every time. So I just, I take the guys to a class, you know, 30, 45 minutes or whatever. I show them, we go through a few hitters and I'm like, now if you want information, what I want you to do is you do the scout, you do it. You come to me and let's compare. And I was like, if you got something egregiously different, then let's talk about it. Why I see what I see, why you see what you see. Because I want them to have conviction in whatever they're doing. I don't want them, if they want the information, don't just pick it up, read it and go, cool, throw it away. Then I don't want to share it with you because it does, does us no good. But if you, if you put a little bit of work in behind it, I think you'll be a little bit more convicted in what's going on. So. But I don't think, I don't think they need it and I don't think that they really care to read it. They may say that they do, but most of them away. Yeah, I think most of them are just saying that to think that they need to say that. [00:45:17] Speaker A: What about calling pitch? [00:45:22] Speaker B: I call all of our defense, so I call the pitches, picks first and thirds, buns and, and then do all the positioning. And then I, so I do pre game positioning with cards coach. The pair during the game will be on making sure people are on the, where they're supposed to be, but the guys all have cards in their pockets. And then I call the pitches. Our guys have the ability to shake. They can switch location or they can switch the pitch, whichever. And then sometimes I would say I probably got. So we use swipes, but I probably got swiped like four times last year, the whole year. So I think at a point it got to where they didn't need to think they needed to do it. Now I've had several guys with like a 5, 6 pitch mix mix. They'll swipe a little more than, than others, and I'm completely okay with it. I always tell them I'd like us to swipe in the same direction. So if I'm going like, let's just not make it, you know, I go back door breaking ball and you go like heater in. It's like we got two different ends of the spectrum here. So unless the guy's got a bunch of holes. But yeah, so we typically. It's just a lot of conversation to make sure we're on the same page [00:46:36] Speaker A: with getting into the season. So long. What'd you do with your arms? Did you send guys out or did you shut most of your guys down? [00:46:46] Speaker B: So a lot of guys, guys that threw a ton didn't really go out. So I mean, one was a senior, the other one was going to Virginia. The other, other senior bullpen guy, he's done some of the guys that were, you know, 12 to 20 inning guys, they're out playing and throwing, but I don't think we really didn't have. I would say the only guy that threw a decent amount was for us was Mars. And, and he went to Virginia and he's trying, he's doing a little two way deal down in Virginia because he didn't hit very much for us. But we're trying to get him to hit next year. So he's in Virginia doing a little two way deal and, and doing just okay. But for him, his arm was fine and he, he didn't throw a ton in the fall. So he'll probably take the fall off from pitching. I think that's one of the crazier things, by the way, is like the, the yearly calendar cycle that bothers me so much on Twitter is like people yelling at people for throwing like 100 pitches in January. And I'm like, you have no idea how much he's been throwing. Like this may be the middle of his season. You know what I mean? So I'm sorry, I just. It bothers the crap out of me. So, yeah, like, so. So Mars won't throw this fall, so he'll probably start on ramping in October and then he'll be, he'll be like really full go by time January and February hit. So if we play opening day and he starts on opening day, he can throw 100 pitches. It's not really an issue where you know, other guys that are going to throw all fall, then they'll shut down late, they'll be shut down through November and start on ramping again in December. So. And their cycle will be just a little bit different. [00:48:29] Speaker A: How will his routine, if he is really going to be a two way player for you all, how will his routine change? [00:48:35] Speaker B: Yeah, it's always a tough one. I think it's a ton of conversation. I always say like nobody monitors infield and outfield throws very much. I don't know too many people that do. So we typically do a decent job. And I just try to communicate a ton of like, hey, if this is like your low intent day, you can't be out here feeling ground balls a third, like go to first base, go hit and don't throw. And now if it's your medium or heavy intent day, then you want to go knock stuff out and like don't play catch with the pitchers and come over here and do a ton of throwing. Cool. But you kind of have to, they have to be smart more often than not. The two way guy, it's, it's overuse issues more than anything. For sure. Yeah. [00:49:20] Speaker A: For pitchers that are coming into the program, what do you think they're lacking? Ones that, what do they need help with before they get to you? What do you have to play catch up with on them? [00:49:32] Speaker B: I would say one, the pace of the game is a crazy switch for them. We turned the pitch clock on early and it's really rough. They feel like, you can tell that they feel like they're underwater, they just can't breathe, they can't move fast enough. So that's one, that's, that's like an easy one. I think like pitching wise, the difference in the strike zone being smaller and people not chasing as much is shocking to them most of the time. So they feel like they have nowhere to throw the ball. And again then it goes back to like I always say, like once we get over the plate, then you start to figure out if you can pitch or not. Like before then it doesn't really matter. But then guys would get over the plate, get hit really hard and then they'll go, oh, I just cut too much plate. And I'm like, no, it wasn't good enough. Like it was A perfect amount of plate, but it wasn't good enough. So that's always the shocking, like, kind of growth of a young guy is like, get over the dish. And now we got over the dish. Is it good or is it not good? And usually it's, you know, maybe there's one that's a really good pitch, a really good heater, but the other stuff's not very good. And then the other one is like, a lot of times they just have no idea what they actually throw and what's good. They really don't know. Like, sometimes guys will have a really good change up and they'll say, it's my fourth best pitch and I don't throw it very much, but I love my curveball. I'm like, your curveball stinks. So I think that's, that's probably the other, the other growth. But outside of pitching, physicality. Physicality is, I would say it's a 90th percentile of guys that walk in the door. They're not strong enough. They. They don't have the stamina to do it. They're not physically strong enough, they're not explosive enough. That's usually the separator or just like in good enough shape. And they can make that body transformation that you talked about earlier, which I think usually does in turn, have people throw a little harder, have people at least be healthier. But usually that strength base is really not there. I think that's why we see so many TJ's in high school at this point, which is guys are throwing a lot harder in high school, but they're not any bigger. They're still 147 pounds, throwing 88. [00:51:46] Speaker A: And general fitness by the wayside. General fitness has gone by the wayside. [00:51:51] Speaker B: Yep, yep. So there's not. Not in good enough shape. And they're. They just don't have enough stability in their joints to do anything, like, repeatedly. So, you know, you get a lot of. You get a lot of really, really good for 10 pitches and then really, really bad for 10 pitches. [00:52:08] Speaker A: You have any advice for young coaches trying to get in it? [00:52:12] Speaker B: Don't do it. No, no. Sound like my parents. Yeah. Yeah. Sound like my wife. I. I love what I do. I would say if you're young. We were just talking about this the other day, but I really do. I think one of the cool things that Rob did with me, so I got there, and Rob's obviously a pitching guy, so I'm now like the second pitching coach. And so it was one. It was cool. Because you never work with another pitching coach, like nobody ever does, right? You're the guy on the island that has to talk to himself all the time. Ask yourself ideas. So working with Rob was great because you actually had someone you could go in and go like, hey, I tried this with him, it's not working. What would you do if you're, if you're struggling with this slider and you can't really get him on top of the ball, what would you do? And so it was cool to have the. A guy right there you could bounce ideas off of. But with Rob, he would be like, hey, look, if I come down there, me, and you're in the pen, like, I. If you see a guy and you want to make him like a project and he's not one of our guys, like, do it. I don't care what you do. Like free reign. You want to try some cool stuff. You want to try blindfolded, you want to try having thrown the dark, whatever you want. So I get to try a lot of really cool stuff, stuff that I would never do with, you know, someone that I thought was going to help us. But yeah, I did eyes closed bullpens, I did bullpens in the dark to like a net, all kinds of crazy stuff. And I think that's, that's one thing where it's like, understand who you are on the staff. I think is important because a lot of guys want to work with a shiny toy, but they don't want to work with the guy who's not any good. And it's like, no, like that's where you like cut your teeth a little bit, is go down there and try to really help the guy who's struggling and not. He doesn't have good self confidence, he doesn't have anything. But you'll, you'll find yourself if you can go help that guy out. Instead of going to the number one and going, I want to hang out with you when you play catch. It's like, don't do that. He doesn't need any help. He's great. Like, leave him alone. So I would say that two, just try to learn. I think the baseball community is such a close knit community and, and a lot of people are willing to help and talk. So I had a kid from, I think like north, some maybe North Carolina Wesleyan reach out in the middle of the year and was like, hey, I just wanted to reach out and pick your brain about a couple things. And he's a young guy, I think 23, 24 or something like that, but was awesome. Like super, super good questions. He tried to implement. He implemented a few things and he's like, it's working. Thanks a lot. Catch up after the season. And so most people are willing to help. There's not a lot of real bad guys in the game, but most people are not willing to ask for help. [00:54:51] Speaker A: I think it's the biggest one. We talk about that at the convention and the rookie mentorship meeting is like, you have to be vocal. Like eventually you're gonna have to talk to people. Like, if you, if you want to make your way in this profession, you have to get uncomfortable and be comfortable with asking questions and, and yes, let people talk and ask questions. But like, you have to. If you're, you're. You're never gonna make it in this profession if you can't eventually ask people questions. [00:55:14] Speaker B: Yeah, I wholeheartedly agree. [00:55:16] Speaker A: How do you guys handle workouts? I know your guys class schedule is probably crazy for guys. Do you get them all in there at the same time or are they getting in on their own at different times? [00:55:26] Speaker B: For lifts? [00:55:27] Speaker A: Yeah, for lifts, yeah. [00:55:30] Speaker B: So we lift. We lift three days a week and we're on the field three days a week. In the fall and in the springtime we actually did something a little outside the box, I guess, but we actually just quit having practice on the. The nights we were supposed to lift because we were supposed to lift and then go practice right afterwards at like, we practiced from 6:30 to 8:30 at night in the indoor. So we're supposed to lift at 5:30 practice at 6:30 to 8:30. It made no sense. Our guys couldn't like eat dinner. They couldn't, they couldn't study in those nights. And so we were just all waxed those evenings. So we decided like, hey, if. If the, if jumping on the force plates and us getting a really good lift in are actually important. We say it's important, but we're not acting like it's important. So we just kind of made the full sail switch. Like we'll do any days during the morning. So I get like small groups of pitchers, small groups of hitters. Our guys go lift at 5:30 and they're done for the night. On three days a week in the spring when we first start, because it's like, if we're going to get off to a good start, we got to be really strong, got to be explosive, and that's when we're in a really kind of power phase in the weight room and trying to get ourselves moving Fast and throwing weight around really fast. So I think it's a good, usually a good start to the spring. One, our guys get off to a better start academically because it is tough. And then two, we get off to a really good start in the weight room. And, you know, when you're on a tennis court and you're in an indoor batting cage, if you can do anything and get off to a good start in the classroom and off to a good start in the weight room, it's not bad. Like, it's probably better than what you were going to do hitting fly balls with a tennis racket to your outfielders. [00:57:09] Speaker A: What has the state of Ohio meant to you? [00:57:13] Speaker B: I've lived here my whole life pretty much other than the. The one. One, one year in Buchanan at West Virginia Wesleyan and then two at Ohio Valley in Parkersburg. So. But I was born in West Virginia. Right across the river is the only place the hospital was. But, yeah, I've lived in Ohio my whole life. So. Buckeyes fan, you know, grew up watching. Watching the Buckeyes and Trestle and those guys and. And now, you know, still still a Buckeyes fan and get to live in Columbus, so. But yeah, obviously I. I love Ohio. [00:57:46] Speaker A: Akron out of high school. Is Rick Ramlak there when you there? [00:57:49] Speaker B: No. So I was. I got recruited by Bernie and then Banger was my coach, so. Pat Bankston, love coach. He was awesome. Yeah, we and him got along great because we could talk hunting. So that was it. Oh, yeah, all the time. I just killed a bear like two weeks ago. [00:58:10] Speaker A: Where were you at? [00:58:12] Speaker B: New Brunswick, Canada. [00:58:13] Speaker A: I love it. [00:58:15] Speaker B: Yeah. So I go. My parents own like 220 acres in southeastern Ohio and so still go deer hunting down there. And. And then me and my dad do a little father son bear trip usually once every year. And then the fall kept moving later and later, and it kind of messed with our football season, so we had to stop. And then this year was. He was like, let's just do a spring hunt. So we went. So literally, we won the World Series. I went to Disney with my wife, and my son came back from Disney. I went on a bear trip for a week. [00:58:46] Speaker A: So bow or rifle? [00:58:49] Speaker B: So I've killed. I've killed three with a bow. And this time I used a rifle because I hadn't shot. It was right after a season I hadn't shot a bow. And I was like, I'm not taking my bow. Have not shot it in six months. So I took a rifle. [00:59:02] Speaker A: I had a player from Iowa, he Lives in Montana, but pistol and a knife. [00:59:08] Speaker B: Pistol, yeah. [00:59:10] Speaker A: Wild. He's a great catcher for that reason, but every once in a while, I would call him, like, what are you doing? And he's like, I'm trying to kill a bear with pistol and a knife. I'm like, good luck. [00:59:20] Speaker B: Yeah, I, I. The bow ones were fun. That was. It was a really good challenge. And. And it was fun. And then. But when I went out with the pistol, I was like. I was like, I'm gonna take a bow. My dad goes, all right. He's like, shoot yourself. I'm taking. I'm taking a rifle. And I was like, yeah. It's like, I feel good. I was like, I'll just take my. I'll take a pistol, put it on my hip. And he goes, you can't get a pistol across the border. And I was like, can I take a knife? He said, sure, you can take a knife. So I took, like, a buoy knife that was, like, this long. So, yeah, it's. It's a lot of fun. They're. They're really. They're really smart animals. They're tough. They can smell really well. They. They hear really well, but they're quiet. They're like ghosts, Like a black ghost walking through the woods. [01:00:06] Speaker A: All right, you have your fail forward moment, something you thought was going to set you back, but looking back now, it helped you move forward. [01:00:13] Speaker B: Probably the. Probably the Dayton trip, you know, going down there. Like, I played Division 1 baseball. I wanted to coach Division 1 baseball, and that's kind of when I. What I set out to do, and obviously I got that opportunity, and I thought, okay, here we go. I'll make this move. And then it was like, I'm not. I'm not very good at this. Just ran this thing. I helped run it in the ground, you know, so that's kind of how it felt. But it led me to get a chance to work with Rob, and that kind of changed my mindset on being a good pitching coach and, and winning and that sort of stuff. And then. And then Link leaves and digs, calls me back, and it just kind of all kind of worked out, and we got to move back to Columbus, and my wife's friends were all in Columbus, so she didn't want to. We were living in Lancaster at the time, so that's. That's not where you wanted to be. So. Ended up moving back to Columbus. So that was definitely probably it. You know, I thought I messed up. I. I tried this too soon, or I wasn't ready or I thought it was. You know what I mean? I just made a mistake and, or everybody made a mistake on my behalf, whatever it was. But yeah, I didn't feel prepared probably when I first got there. And then I think by the time I probably felt prepared it was over. You know, it's kind of how it felt. [01:01:27] Speaker A: A lot of it's learning on the fly with all that stuff too. Especially trying to balance scholarship stuff. [01:01:32] Speaker B: Yeah. Yeah. That's how I felt. And I, I always tell people, I think, I think I was probably a little immature with the scholarship stuff because I think, I think it changed the way I treated people and I, and I hated that. And I knew it, I could sense it. But I would be honest, I would, I would still talk to Diggs and I'd be like, yeah, I'm mad at this guy because I, we gave him 50 and he's not any good. Right. [01:01:58] Speaker A: It's not his fault. [01:01:59] Speaker B: Right. [01:02:00] Speaker A: It's like, you know, the hardest part with all. Yeah. Like it's not the kid's fault. Like. [01:02:05] Speaker B: Yes, it was my first time. [01:02:06] Speaker A: Variety of reasons why it doesn't work out for kids and you know, that's the trick. Tricky part. Obviously different now for schools now that have a lot of scholarship money to give out, but. [01:02:16] Speaker B: Right. [01:02:17] Speaker A: But back then it means a lot like it does. Your high end scholarship guys need to, you need to hit on and you're not going to hit on all of them. [01:02:25] Speaker B: You're just not right. And UD was a four year commitment too, so you couldn't pull scholarships. So it's like now they can just. Sorry that didn't work out. You're going to have to go, you know, you're going to have to go someplace else. [01:02:37] Speaker A: But do you have any evening or morning routines? You go to anything? I know it's hard. Family. [01:02:46] Speaker B: I'm with the boy in the morning, so Ledger's four in the mornings. I'm. I take him to daycare. So we hang out in the mornings, you know, play around and evenings it's the same pretty much for me now it's pretty simple, you know. And right, right now I'm the play guy. So throw me this. Go climb this tree with me. Can you ride? Yeah. [01:03:09] Speaker A: So five is a wonderful full time. [01:03:11] Speaker B: Yeah. It just doesn't stop. But he wants to do something different and then he gets bored after like 30 seconds. So you do something, then you turn around, you gotta do something else. But that's pretty much my routine at this point. [01:03:20] Speaker A: What are some final thoughts [01:03:24] Speaker B: I don't have any man, I think. Thanks for having me on. I know you guys do a great job in sharing the game and obviously getting people involved in the game and keeping them involved in the game. So I appreciate you having me on and hopefully if anybody wants to talk, wants to talk shop, talk, pitching, whatever, reach out. I'm always open book and I can try to help. I failed enough at doing a bunch of different stuff so you can ask me and I probably tried it and failed. But yeah, just would love to connect with people. [01:03:58] Speaker A: I always look forward to connecting with our assistant coaches of the year. They always provide great insights on the nuts and and bolts of running a program. Congrats to Coach Romick and his well deserved honor and Denison's first national championship. Thanks again to John Litchfield, Zach Hale and Matt Weston, ABCA Office for all the help on the podcast. Feel free to reach out to me via email our brownleebca.org Twitter, Instagram or TikTok coachbeerabca or direct message me via the MyABCA app. This is Ryan Brownlee signing off for the American Baseball Coaches Association. Thanks and leave a better for those behind you. Wait for another day [01:04:50] Speaker B: and the world will always eternal and your life never for yearning and you know that way [01:05:05] Speaker A: Wait for another day.